NCTD to rain down great fury upon track-crossers
The North County Transit District announced last week that it is "significantly increasing" its enforcement against trespassing along its Coaster rail corridor, which runs from Oceanside to San Diego through Carlsbad, Encinitas, Solana Beach, Del Mar and La Jolla, and along its Sprinter rail corridor, which runs from Oceanside to Escondido through Vista and San Marcos.
Those crossing the track illegally or trespassing on the railroad right-of-way will face criminal penalties for their violation of the law by NCTD’s Transit Enforcement Division Officers, or the San Diego County Sheriff’s Transit Enforcement Services Unit, NCTD officials stated in a news release. The penalties for trespassing on the railroad right-of-way can result in fines up to $500 and/or six months in jail, according to NCTD.
Fucking idiots. This is not 1800 in Russia. The dumb ass tracks should be moved away from the coast. This RR cuts right through the beach area of San Diego North County and is in the worst location possible. move the whole thing to I5 like shown in many alternatives.
ReplyDeleteTony Kranz should be fighting the ticketing big time. What has he done on the subject?
There's no room for the tracks to be moved. They would have had to integrate them into the 5 when it was built.
DeleteBTW, Tony has done a great job advocating for Leucadia, and working with NCTD on the parking and many other issues. Jerome did nothing for us the entire time he was in office. Be glad for what we have!
Consider what we could have done as a nation with the $4 Trillion wasted in Iraq and Afghanistan with our tax dollars.
DeleteTime to rebuild America and moving the tracks or trenching the tracks is just one of many good examples!
If Clinton is elected, the wars will continue. If Trump wins, he'll nuke the Mideast. America is screwed wither way.
DeleteWe spent $43 Million of our taxes to put in just one public gasoline station in Afghanistan.
DeleteThe money for just that gas station could have built the trench for these publicly owned train tracks!
To solve this problem all they have to do is put in at-grade-crossing so it is safer and legal. To increase enforcement is temporary and all it will do is cause ill-will between NCTD, the sheriff's department and the public. Bad idea.
ReplyDeleteSo you have a quasi-governmental agency announcing that they will begin to enforce existing law on areas within their domain.......why does this sound so familiar.........hmmmmmmm
ReplyDelete- The Sculpin
As always Sculpin plays the idiot card .
ReplyDeleteHere's an idea: Mass civil disobedience with thousands of people crossing the tracks at the same time. Train schedules are well known, so it would be safe to do so. Keep it up and at $500 a head we'll soon have enough money to bury the tracks. Apologies to Encinitas Guerrilla.
ReplyDeleteIf NCTD/sheriff ticket track crossers for trespassing, then they also better ticket the hundreds of people who park their vehicles in the RR right-of-way.
ReplyDeleteOtherwise, the crossers can claim selective enforcement in court. Crossers and parkers are both trespassing.
That parking is sanctioned by NCTD, and was one of the things Tony worked with them on when all the new restaurants came in.
Delete-MGJ
Tony Kranz wants an agreement whereby the parking will be paved, and the City, and eventually those parking, will have to pay to park. The free dirt parking will cease if Tony's plans comes to fruition.
DeleteNo one can claim they were here before the tracks. Sure the Coaster has added to the number of trains but the tracks have always been active and SANDAG gets sued because the Regional Transportation Plan doesn't emphasize transit enough. What to do?
ReplyDeleteBury the tracks? Highly unlikely through Cardiff or downtown Encinitas, maybe Leucadia. At-grade crossing? The city is still progressing with the Montgomery at-grade crossing.
While many of the rail deaths are suicides, when double tracking is installed look for incidents to increase. You would think people would automatically look both ways but I wouldn't count on it.
I remember when I parked on San Elijo and was about to walk across the tracks to go surfing but noticed the hired guard down the trail. I walked up to him and asked I could cross the tracks......he gave a disgusting look and said "NO, sheeesh".
ReplyDeleteI got back in my car with my wetsuit on and drove over to the 101.
Back then I didn't know you'd get a ticket for crossing the tracks.
I wonder what all the Del Mar people think when the train cops are sitting at the dead end streets handing out tickets!
Surely nobody posting here really means "bury the tracks." That would mean the tracks would be underground with tons of dirt on top of them.
ReplyDeleteMaybe rather than "bury the tracks," those posters mean drop the tracks below grade in a tunnel or a trench?
Back in the mid-'90s, it seemed "highly unlikely" the Solana Beach tracks would go below grade, yet they did.
Before 2002, it seemed "highly unlikely" the Alameda rail corridor between San Pedro and Los Angeles would go below grade, yet it did.
http://www.railway-technology.com/projects/alameda/
Both Solana Beach and the Alameda corridor had leverage. Since Del Mar didn't want the new Coaster station, Solana Beach said it would take it if the tracks went under Lomas Santa Fe. There are so many long, slow freight trains through the Alameda corridor that traffic grinds to a halt. All Cardiff can say is they want to walk directly to the beach.
DeleteTunnel the tracks and sell the naming rights for the land above to pay for it.
DeleteThe Mizel open space coastal preserve, sure, why not.
DeleteOr just make it paid parking for beach goers, that could help fund the tunneling(but not burying) of the tracks.
Solana beach applied for and got the federal money need to trench the tracks through town and under Lomas Santa Fe. Encinitas did not.
DeleteLeverage starts with local politicians' commitment.
ReplyDeleteNone have the balls to buck SANDAG's preference for freeways.
Freeways bring more development, which is what the cities that make up SANDAG want.
"Freeways bring more development"
DeleteAnd roosters cause sunrise.
Freeways bring more urban sprawl.
DeleteGreat keep the current freeways and the cost for commuting goes up .
It's that simple. Widening freeways is purely for development interests.
Or just install red lights, speed bumps, draw bridges, and incorrect signage on the freeways, eh 12:50?
DeleteEngineered chaos.
Brilliant.
10:58am. You are an idiot to keep on responding in the same way every time someone mentions burying the tracks. You know better, but choose to post the same old crapola.
ReplyDeleteI suppose burying the tracks from view would better suit you, but everyone else knows what is meant. Geez. Give us a break.
Any increase in ticketing is selective prosecution, as long as the bar patrons are allowed to park on the railroad right of way. That shows what the corruptive power the bars have that they get permission to trespass freely. Our rep Tony, helped make that parking available, so Tony, why not do something for our community and not just for all the bar patrons?
Focus on 'lowering' and burying the tracks from view [is that clear enough for you, 10:58am?] and/or getting us all the at grade crossings at a minimum. Tony, do something for us, why don't you?
Not sure how you get to "selective enforcement". If Tony was able to secure an agreement with NCTD to allow parking on the NCTD right of way, then it's not trespassing. But there is no such agreement for crossing the tracks - that's still illegal. So please, elaborate.....
Delete- The Sculpin
Tony is all about the bars.
Delete12:36 OK, I mean "train" but every time I mention it I'll type "balloon" and you figure out I mean "train."
ReplyDeleteBurying the tracks is one thing, tunneling or trenching them are other things. It helps to say what you mean, not to leave it open to guesswork.
The RR right-of-way is posted "No Trespassing." So that doesn't apply to motorized vehicles, but it applies to everything else?
I've lived here (near the tracks) over 35 years.I only know of three fatalities on the tracks that were not suicides. An unattended baby, some folks playing cards, and some older folks that stumbled along with another person trying to help them.
DeleteI know a couple of people walking their dogs in Leucadia who got hit and were killed. It has always been posted no trespassing. They're getting ready for when they begin the work to double track the whole corridor, which will be fenced off anyway.
ReplyDeleteTrench and cover is the only reasonable way to deal with this publicly owned land that the NCTD uses or train tracks.
ReplyDeleteIf done correctly it would enhance access to beaches, parks and businesses and include parking and better access to public transportation - with revenue generating opportunities for long term financing of the project.
Anybody ever wonder why Metrolink does not have a problem with people crossing the tracks in San Clemente to Dana Point?
ReplyDeleteWhere paths every hundred feet are available for the public to cross the train tracks without the treat of police...
They're called at-grade pedestrian crossings. They have lights and gates just like street crossings. I wonder what you don't seem to understand.
DeleteNo lights or gates on any of these crossings used by beach goers in San Clemente to Dana Point that Metrolink has no problems with...
DeletePeople should ride the train and see how many crossings are up there.
Silly NCTD cannot have a reasonable solution to their use of public property here in San Diego County.
OCTA (Orange County Transportation Authority) owns the right-of-way. Metrolink, Amtrak and BNSF all use the track. San Clemente has a number of at-grade pedestrian crossings. Any other crossing is illegal.
DeleteThis is from the OCTA website:
"Stay off the tracks.
"Tracks are for trains. They are private property. Walking, jogging or playing on or near the train tracks is considered trespassing and is illegal."
"Look out for trains.
"Trains will not always sound warning horns. Many cities have established quiet zones in residential and business areas along the tracks, so trains are no longer sounding their horns, unless there is an emergency. As a pedestrian, you should always stop, look and listen for a train before crossing the tracks at designated pedestrian crossings."
Sounds like they do have a problem with it.
If people were to ride the train to Orange County you would see at grade with no signs or gates crossings every hundred feet used by beach goers ... Obviously Metrolink et al seem to have little problem with those people crossing the tracks there.
DeleteUnlike our publicly owned tracks run by NCTD in San Diego...
7:03,
DeleteSan Clemente is installing fencing, gates, and horns.
"Safety enhancements include wider paved areas, new fencing, additional crossing gate arms, improved signs and the installation of electrical work for the audible warning system."
http://www.octa.net/Projects-and-Programs/All-Projects/Rail-Projects/Railroad-Crossing-Enhancements/San-Clemente-Pedestrian-Crossings/
7:03 AM
DeleteNo one doubts that beach goers cross the tracks illegally in San Clemente just as they do in Cardiff. It's another thing to say that these are sanctioned crossings by OCTA, which as 7:11 AM pointed out, they aren't.
Nor will the safety enhancements stop all illegal crossings. Old habits die hard. One aspect that works against dissuading illegal crossing is the trains slow down through San Clemente which makes it less risky.
Practically every home that backs to the railway in San Clemente has private stairs and access to the beach crossing the tracks in San Clemente.
DeleteAnd I do not see Metrolink and the other players there doing anything to stop them from using these paths to cross the rails.
I also give credit to Metrolink for at least making some of the more used trails safer by putting in at grade crossings.
Seeing NCTD is a public agency like those in Orange county. Perhaps NCTD can learn from our neighbor up north and work to increase access across our railroad tracks instead of removing access like NCTD is proposing.
12:47 PM
Delete"And I do not see Metrolink and the other players there doing anything to stop them from using these paths to cross the rails."
How do you know? Have you spent a lot of time watching or just ridden by on a passing train?
Yes, some of us do ride the train... everyday for work to Santa Ana. Where Metrolink does nothing to deter crossing of tracks all over the place in San Clemente. And trains actually slow down in the beach areas to help make it safer for these hundreds of at grade crossings without signs, gates, lights or horns.
Delete1:59 PM
DeleteFunny, but I commuted to Orange County for many years both on Amtrak and Metrolink. I too saw people waiting for the train to pass to cross illegally. That doesn't mean those crossings were sanctioned by OCTA or Metrolink. The tracks run all the way through OC which is a lot of right-of-way to patrol.
Just like in Leucadia and Cardiff many people cross the tracks illegally without getting caught but that doesn't mean NCTD is okay with it.
By the way, the trains have slowed down through there for years not to make it safer to cross illegally but because of the rail positioning. They actually slow after passing many of those illegal spots.
Indeed some laws are just stupid. Like making it illegal to cross a road or a railroad track where people need access to cross and where crossings should be.
DeleteDo we need a Nanny state? Just let the people cross the tracks as they have. No reason to make a problem when there is none. Yes, people get hit by cars and trains when they make bad decisions.
Yet the real problem is with the road or railroad in this case. Instead of fixing the problem some just want to make a bigger problem. Like NCTD is in this case.
5:24 I wonder why you have to come across with put-downs so you can feel oh so superior.
ReplyDeleteThere's a ped crossing in the Encinitas Coaster station. It has lights but no gates.
Deaths by train in the Encinitas rail corridor average one per year. That some of them are suicides isn't an excuse.
Almost all of them are suicides. And yes, it matters. People wanting to kill themselves are unlikely to be deterred by the treat of a $500 fine and jail time which they won't be around to serve.
DeleteI'm sure that two year old in Leucadia some years ago was just committing suicide. As double tracking becomes the norm and train frequency increases, so will accidents. We could just let natural selection do its work but that's not how we do things. I doubt double tracking will have much effect on the number of suicides.
DeleteRight. Because threat of prosecution is a great deterrent for 18-month-old toddlers who wander away from their homes.
DeleteFourteen deaths by train in Encinitas in 15 years. Reading the news reports, it's impossible to tell exactly how many were suicides. Best estimate is less than one third.
DeleteSince there is no barrier to prevent that toddler from wandering on to the track. So you're saying why try if we can't prevent every occurrence.
DeleteBy the way, get to know some of the engineers who have hit people, suicide or not, even close calls, and see how it effects them.
The point is, legal threats don't influence suicides or toddlers.
DeleteIf you're advocating miles of chain link fence on both sides of the tracks, why don't you come out and say it?
I'm running for Emperor of Encinitastan.
DeleteWe're going to build a big wall along the tracks and make the suicidal people pay for it.
We'll also start a trade war with Carlsbad, and win many many things.
Many things.
Many advocate lowering the tracks below grade, fencing the trench and constructing many crossings as rim-to-rim ramps through the corridor.
Delete11:03 AM
DeleteAs a long time Leucadia resident who often crosses the tracks, I've always been in favor of several at-grade crossings with a low fence (4') along the right-of-way. While an undercrossing would be good, they are expensive. Sure it would be a pain in the ass but it would be safer. Just not perfect. And it doesn't have to be a chain link fence.
Paul Gaspar has filed his 410 and 501 papers as a candidate for mayor of Encinitas.
ReplyDeleteWho cares?
DeleteHe's going down
DeleteSadly, the No on the Rail Trail group seems to be supporting Paul Gaspar, as a response to Catherine flip flopping all over the place. Further implications are left to anyones imagination. Kristins Pac is run by non other than ssssssssssss, which means he is not that far from Paul or the Rail Trail group.
ReplyDeleteIf only it wasn't so. Say it ain't so Joe. Their activism has been inspiring and gives hope that with effective organizing, we, the people, can demand our reps defend us.
No Trail said they have been mentored by Paul Gaspar. They are also supporting Phil Graham. They are pro-development other than in their backyard.
DeleteI have yet to see a statement from Gaspar or any other mayor candidate regarding this issue of double tracking and fencing to remove access to the beach and business districts here in Encinitas...
DeleteTypical developer crowd.... It's fine to shit on others to make profit.
ReplyDeleteIt is a development issue. As when the tracks were built and homes put in initially a hundred years ago there was no issue with people crossing the railroad tracks anywhere here in Encinitas.
DeleteNow with wall to wall housing, no parking and too many people... We have not properly built up the infrastructure to support the increased density of people.
The railroad tracks is just one of many examples of a failure to provide infrastructure to match development.
Bottom line, trench and cover the tracks for safety, parking and access that we should have!
They should just slow down the trains in Encinitas until they get the railroad trenched and covered.
ReplyDeleteThis is all too funny. I have been complaining about people living in the railroad right of way in Cardiff for two months now and the city, the Sheriffs and NCTD have done nothing about it! So... people can live in the right of way but don't cross the tracks or jog there you'll get a ticket!
ReplyDeleteYeah, that guy living in his covered car. What a piece of junk that car is....
DeleteNo problem. Just wait until Phase 2 of the high speed rail project, which will build new track up the 15 corridor.
ReplyDeleteThat shouldn't take long.
http://www.hsr.ca.gov/docs/newsroom/maps/LA_to_San_Diego.pdf
point being. Vote out all incumbents.
ReplyDeleteOne post mentioned flash mobbing, my term, the tracks, and demanding they be lowered before the double tracking is allowed through our corridor. If only that were possible. The double tracks are already here, just not at the intersections. Does approving this double tracking through our divided, literally, community actually rely upon our councils permission?
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't think we would have any say on that private property area.
If bar patrons have found a way to trespass thanks councilperson Tony, on the right of way, how about giving a break to those others where no at grade crossings have been provided or at least fight to trench the tracks.
Our best county supervisor said he can't help without express desire from our council persons. Why is there no one speaking up at our city in favor of lowering the tracks? Ask any candidate yourselves and let us know what you find.
First it is public property. The citizens of San Diego County purchased this railroad long ago,.
DeleteSecond, building permits are required to make changes for the railroad. Permits come from the City of Encinitas.
The currently is only a passing track for a portion of the publicly owned railroad in Encinitas. It is not a double track.
DeleteWe should ensure that a Environmental Impact study is done before any double tracking/further expansion of our railroad happens.
Trenching and covering is the long term answer for our railroad in Encinitas.
Other "public" property we don't have a right to trespass on: Lindbergh Field, Pendelton, San Clemente Island.
DeleteThe land is owned by a government agency, but it is not open to the public for obvious reasons.
Pretty dumb to compare a secure Military facility to publicly owned land for roads and rails as an excuse to forbid the owners of this public land usage of it.
DeleteIf you'd like to test your legal theory, be my guest.
DeleteI encourage you to get yourself arrested and use the Cliven Bundy defense. Maybe you will meet him.
2:03 PM
DeletePerhaps you'd rather cross the runway at Lindbergh to prove your point.
Bottom line - continue to cross our publicly owned tracks like we have ever since they were laid down.
ReplyDeleteWe own this railroad.