In the U-T, Lisa Shaffer and Tony Kranz share their thoughts on their first year in a roundup of freshman council members around the county.
Asked to expand on the highlights and disappointments, Shaffer emailed
the best part has been “a new kind of leadership on the City Council.”
“I think we have created a new expectation of civility and respect,” she
said, “and it has enabled us to work together across differences.”
As for disappointments, she said she was “sad at the divisive tone and
misleading messaging” at the Proposition A special election last June.
We share Shaffer's sadness at the divisive tone and we wish we could remember who was responsible for the misleading messaging.
Kranz emphasized the positive impact of strategic planning:
Her colleague Kranz said: “Looking back on my first year on the City Council makes me feel very grateful for the opportunity to serve my community. I’d say that the council’s biggest decision this year, one that will position us for future success, was to engage in a strategic planning process in order to establish next year’s budget priorities for both operations and capital improvement projects.
“One of the frustrating parts of governing is how long it takes to get things done. But I’m looking forward to this next year, when we’ll be implementing some new ways for the public to contribute to the conversation.”
The only significant thing this council did was band together against prop.A and have all their pictures on a mailer that had a laundry list of blatant lies and distortions.Now that's an example of D work.
ReplyDeleteThe Cabezon
Kranz and Shaffer are congratulating themselves on how well council members support one another.
ReplyDeleteWhere do citizens fit into this formula? When citizens share evidence about important issues, the Mayor attacks them. Who is responsible for Rossini Creek?
Why aren't they contrite and ashamed that Vina and Sabine kept the environmental violations under wraps for 10 months? Why didn't they stop it when they still could have taken action to protect the creek?
I don't understand why Shaffer is expressing gratitude when her former supporters are attacking her for her repeated lapses of ethical behavior.
Because she'll need them to finance her next campgain. And the idiots will give her money again.
DeleteShaffer is in the Ivory Tower still ...
DeleteThe lack of WHO was responsible for the Prop A "misleading messaging" is one in a long list of examples of Shaffer's absolute inability to take responsibility for anything.
ReplyDeleteIf she means "sorry I put my name on a lie that went out to the voters," then she should say that. But perhaps that's not what she believes?
The "new kind of leadership" is that Gus Vina takes our money, decides everything, and tells the council what to do. Traditionally, it is the council who are responsible for making sure that the CM and the CA are doing their jobs. The new leadership is that the council follows them.
ReplyDeleteInstead of managing the city, council members go to ribbon cuttings, give presentations about themselves, and compliment themselves on their leadership.
Citizens expect accountability--not a publicity-seeking who use their status to make excuses instead of doing their jobs.
I meant to say, "not a publicity-seeking council who use their status to make excuses instead of doing their jobs."
DeleteSo let me understand... you have accomplished absolutely nothing significant in a year other than to congratulate yourself. Seek help.
ReplyDeleteIs Shaffer tone deaf? Some of us haven't forgotten who's responsible for the misleading messages on Prop. A. Remember 30-ft accessory units five feet from the property line? This interview is another big misstep.
ReplyDeleteThis new council needs to think for themselves and not take their marching orders from Vina and $abine. There is the learning curve, but that excuse is wearing thin. they need to take definite action on pension reform and appropriate land use planning for community character (by community consensus). Reputations form fast when terms are short and action is called for quickly.
ReplyDeleteIf y'alls council critters want to do something that will impress the smart people, how about insisting on a transparent audit of the city and a review of the sustainability of city pay and benefits.Until this is done you all have got nothing. I'm getting the impression that when you folks use the term "sustainable" you are really talking about sustaining the house of cards that is a slap in the face to those of us that work in the private sector.Keep in mind that I'm a socialist leaning liberal/not an anti-gov wacko. Sorry I gave any of you F%$#Ks a dime.
DeleteThe Cabezon
You gave these a$$holes money?? You're as big an idiot as they are. Liberal socialist moron.
DeleteAnon 2:22, Anon 1:11 was not alone in giving money to the current council majority. Lisa Shaffer herself raised over $40,000, which is an impressive sum by any measure. She is a good fund raiser.
DeleteShe told at least some of her donors that she wanted to use her background in ethics to clean up City Hall and to get rid of particular bad players. Many of us would donate funds to anyone who would actually follow through on that promise.
I hope that Lisa and Tony find their way back to their base.
Nice try to put a fluff piece in the Union Tribune. As you know, most of your former base does not read it. It was this blog that helped to get you elected and it is this blog that will help to inform voters in Encinitas again.
ReplyDeleteIt was a weak article in the first place and made Kranz and Shaffer sound whiney. When are you going to start taking responsibility for the job that you were hired to do and stop making excuses for yourselves?
Agreed. This is the type of item that only the people who are mentioned in the article would be interested in and would read. It is amazing what is passed off as news in the Union Tribune recently.
DeleteThe only reason that I know about this piece is that someone sent me the link and a comment of astonishment that this had been published.
The people who read the article on account of this blog may not have been left with the impression that Shaffer and Kranz were hoping for.
Delete“One of the frustrating parts of governing is how long it takes to get things done....."
ReplyDeleteOne example of how long it takes to get things done is the Rossini Creek letter from January 2013 that was only made available to the public 10 months later.
Isn't it sad that Gus couldn't get that letter out prior to his excellent evaluation and pay raise? I wonder how that happened? It is just impossible to get anything done in this town! His hands must have been tied!
Yes, great that Encinitas City Council can be civil. But dissent and diversity of opinion are good for a healthy democracy. What has "created a new expectation of civility and respect," has been citizens' voting former Mayor Jerome Stocks out of office in 2012.
ReplyDeleteThe dynamics of Council changed dramatically, too, with Prop A's passage. Our grassroots initiative, in which NO ONE WAS PAID to gather signatures, only passed by a "bare majority," because of the deceptions and "misleading messaging," put out by Council, city staff, city contractors and city subsidiaries/sponsors, like the 101 Mainstreet Associations, the Encinitas Chamber of Commerce, the Encinitas Preservation Association, etc.
Deputy Mayor Lisa Shaffer has been a huge disappointment to so many of her former supporters, because of her "misleading messaging" created when she signed the petition for the initiative, then, after being elected, "changed her mind," and helped to write misleading ballot arguments against Prop A, which arguments were full of lies. The "divisive tone" was created by the "misleading messaging," by Shaffer and Kranz, who signed the petitions, then "flipped." All of the lies have been exposed, finally, by the City's own July 29 online posting on the Encinitas website, through a FAQ sheet about Prop A. Contrary to Council's unanimous deceitful arguments, the NOT impartial analysis, by City Attorney Glenn Sabine, and the pro-development "independent" report through Rutan & Tucker, which enabled the lies, a report full of speculation and conjecture.
Lower set residential height limits have NOT been raised by Prop A's passage; the City was NOT bifurcated by any need for review of the ordinance created by Prop A, or any Local Coastal Program amendments, with respect to the effectiveness date of the initiative.
The Strategic Planning process has put off the public's ability to effectively participate through traditional goal setting workshops. So far the actual workshops have been designed around staff and Council, and contractors, with minimal opportunity for public input. The Strategic Plan process seems to be a way to postpone, to posture, and to pump up Council so that it can stand as a united front against those so-called "obstructionist" activists, that don't want to upzone either UP or OUT!
Many, who follow the City's "machinations" would like our local authorities to follow through with a general amnesty for affordable housing accessory units, as we before had in 1991, so that MORE of the affordable housing we already have in this city can actually be counted. That is how we can create a certified housing element without upzoning. The City also needs a FORENSIC audit, and true budget reform, including pension reform, before it's too late. The City must cut operating expenses, rather than counting on constant expansion, and the resultant developers' fees, property taxes, and sales taxes needed to sustain the MACHINE of ever increasing expenditures.
Gotta get those digs in at those evil Mainstreet associations, don't ya?? Evil sick twisted Mainstreet associations that add value to businesses and merchants.
ReplyDeleteInterestingly, you said nothing about the dangerous roundabouts... You are slipping, perhaps post it notes on your computer will allow you to maintain a sense of focus. And don't forget to bash Norby and PE3, not to mention C. Marvin... He's the ring leader of this triangle of doom for Leucadia. After all it is the Christmas season, you want to maintain a sense of holiday spirit. Something you know so much about....
Again Lynn is absolutely correct. As well she is becoming increasingly popular AND without question more respected than any current council member. Just ask your neighbor.
ReplyDeleteThanks, 3:02! I care about the "popularity" of the message, not myself.
DeleteI do my best not to take the insults personally. For some anonymous poster to spend so much time attacking me, he must feel truly threatened by the message. Truth can hurt. One thing we can all learn is to discern between facts and opinion. How we interpret facts is what forms our opinions. We can all work at being open minded and open hearted. But our connections can be playful, as well. We don't have to do constant battle, resorting to reactive "name-calling," and anger held, that turns to bitterness.
But I stand by my words; L101MA and all the rebranded 101 Mainstreet Associations should NOT be automatically subsidized by the City, but should have to compete for community grant money with the rest of the very well deserving non-profits, including the Foundation formed through the Artists' Colony, to help with the rehabilitation of Pacific View for a true community art and learning center.
I don't post this to defend myself, but to show that my heart is with my community, with my neighbors. I helped Margorie Gaines and Robert Bonde on the North Coast Coalition to Incorporate Encinitas. Since then I have given many hours in working to improve our Community. I have participated in beach clean-ups. I've handed out campaign materials, circulated petitions, and spent countless hours reading and writing about community issues. I continue to advocate that we should stand up for our local trees. Some of the trees being slaughtered are only causing "structural" issues to the curb. That isn't suffiecient reason to take down a structurally sound tree.
I patronize local businesses, such as Just Peachy, La Especial, Sub Palace, Leucadia Glass, and many more. But my goal isn't to be elected. That's not my path. I advocate for power to the people.
Citizens of Encinitas cannot take up the mantle of their own power and responsibility without becoming aware of what's going on, without realizing who the power players are in the game of politics, influence, and inside connections.
Your election is the end of your being. You'll be the ultimate insider. Without a council to rail against how would you survive?? Doubtful you would. As the votes go 4-1 against you, what path will you choose ??
DeletePersonally , I don't think any organization should receive city monies. Not the main streets, art colonies, library, nor playing fields for children, not even parks. If it gets one red nickel of cash , that's too much for me.
PS- if elected, you'll be the first to call to restrict public speaker time to 1 minute or less. Barth will second.
Your fantasies are delusions, 8:19. No need to fear, I'm not running. That's not to say that anyone posting, with passion for the community and for the truth, will not be a factor of influence in next year's election.
DeleteI meant Marjorie Gaines, sorry for another typo, above ;)
DeleteMarjorie Gaines can't run for council, she died over 20 years ago. Get a clue. You calling 8:19 delusional???
DeleteGotta get those digs in at the evil Lynn. How about something constructive? Instead it's always bashing the messenger that you disagree with.
ReplyDeleteBecause her message is wrong....
DeleteOh and I'm off to Santos art gallery and Surfy Surfy to buy some things this holiday season. Two businesses that didn't exist before L101MA and are doing well with the new sidewalks that L101 pushed.
DeleteOh sure, the phony chamber of commerce that's a wolf in sheep's clothing is responsible for those businesses doing OK because they pushed for new sidewalks. So business must be great wherever the wolf reigns and new sidewalks exist. Free enterprise and creating businesses that respond to consumer demand must have nothing to do with it.
DeleteWho's Lynn??
DeleteDefine popular??
Why does she like roundabouts do much ??
I'll respond to your diatribe later, right now I'm enjoying a nice dinner and wine at Solterra. Another winner business supported by L101.
DeleteYour holiday spirit is infectious.....
Spending some of that $30,000 welfare payment you get from taxpayers via the city of Encinitas?
DeleteThose sidewalks are "temporary". That means if we ever get a Street Scape, they'll be torn up and replaced with new one-endorsed by the L101.
DeleteNotice how she's pushing for a general amnesty for illegal housing units. Will that be her first order of business as the first elected mayor of encinitas???
DeleteI like temporary sidewalks... Temp sidewalks from enc blvd to la costa please. And trees and flowers, even if temporary.
DeleteTemporary is good, nothing is bad... Mmmm ok!!!
"And trees and flowers, even if temporary".
Delete"Temporary is good, nothing is bad"
George Orwell: You were so right, Sir.
Only about the Ministry of Thought, telescreens and total surveilance.
Delete1 year for this new council. No discussion on pension reform. Very disappointing.
ReplyDelete2nd year - same as previous year. A citizen sponsored initiative will be the ONLY way it is ever addressed.
DeleteBusiness as usual at city hall. It's just money.
DeleteIts not their money anyway…. and 3 of the 5 are receiving public pensions. One over $170,000 a year forever.
DeleteStatus quo City Council disappointing… I had hoped for more.
ReplyDeleteTerm limits and pension reform for sure.
#1 thing Encinitas needs is pension reform. This city is the Titanic.
ReplyDeleteYup. Keep pounding this topic. Enc to soon have 50 retirees with $100K pensions. In 10 years will be 150.
DeleteI supported Lisa in the election and convinced others to vote for her. I read that quote that she is sad at "the divisive tone and misleading messaging" about Prop A, and I am dumbfounded. I wonder if she does feel her share of responsibility about the tone and misleading messages, but then I really don't think she gets it at all. I don't think she feels she contributed to the divisive tone and misleading messaging. She just had to say she and the council had a role in what happened. But that acknowledgment of her role is missing; and that is baffling. She doesn't seem to know that she, directly, was a huge part of the reason for the harsh tone of Prop A election. And she doesn't seem to get that it was her side of the Prop A argument that was grossly misleading, starting with the Rutan report and then the council's backing of incorrect statements in their ballot arguments against Prop A. None of the fears of the "No" side have happened. She was on the side supported by out-of-town developer money, and against many of the citizens who supported her, and were excited at her election. And then she turned on those who got her elected. Doesn't she get it? Where is the humility? She was on the wrong side of Prop A, and she failed in a major opportunity to show political leadership (and keep a campaign promise). I was really wrong about what she would bring to the council. She is one and done.
ReplyDeleteThis has been a terrible last month for Lisa. She has made mistake on top of mistake, and she keeps digging herself in deeper. Every attempt she makes to correct the course gets her into more trouble.
DeleteThe way for her to get on track is to stop bringing attention (bad attention) to herself and to start focusing on the people who helped her to get the job that she sought.
Her narcissism will be her undoing. Instead of boasting that she got the most votes of anyone in Encinitas history, she could improve her image by giving credit to the people who helped her get those votes. Instead of saying that she doesn't owe anything to anyone since she got money from many sources, she should think of what she promised in her campaign and be true to her word.
Ethical people say things like, “I made this promise when I ran for office, so I am going to do what I said I would do.”
This situation is sad on many levels, and it is no fun to watch someone self-destruct. But as usual, the biggest losers are Encinitas residents.
When did she boast she got the most votes? Not happy with her performance, but this board is pretty much the same whining over and over about ethics and perceived slights. I want to see results, plain and simple, on Sabine, Vina, our Roads, the Rossini Creek fiasco and more. The rest is just the complaining of children.
DeleteWith all due respect Anon 8:43, many so-called obstructionists have been engaged in the process all the way along. Your anger should not be focused on us; it should be focused on the council, who are the decision makers. This council has given complete control to Gus Vina and city employees and refuses to listen to anyone but him.
DeleteThe "Rossini Creek Fiasco" is one of the longest fought issues in Encinitas history. A group of Cardiff citizens spent an entire Saturday engaged in a planning session to share their preferences for a park plan that would have been an actual reflection of what citizens wanted. What they shared was thrown out. A different group of Cardiff citizens ended up suing the city to protect area residents from contaminants in the soil. Protecting the environment and the health of local citizens are functions of our local government, but it was left to a group of Cardiff residents to do this.
Lisa Shaffer made the following comment in the UT article about Prop A, "The proposition, passed by a bare majority, gives voters say on zoning matters."
Is she saying that she approves of the way that the city has mishandled planning issues like the park and Rossini Creek? Personally, I think that Cardiff residents would have done a better job than the city. They identified many of issues more than 10 year ago, but the city ignored them and selected a contractor who lacked the qualifications to do this type of work. The city supervised this work for which we now owe a huge fine. I am concerned for the health and safety of Cardiff residents, and I resent that we have to pay this fine that could have been avoided if we had competent employees at the city, or a council that demanded acceptable work from its staff. The fact that Lisa marginalizes citizens who were right about Rossini Creek and who passed the Prop A initiative suggests that she instead supports the low standards that we see at the City. This entire council has officially lowered the bar for city performance.
Anon 8:43, how do you propose we address Rossini Creek and other issues?
Start by writing an email to the regional water board, then have a meeting with the council person of your choice, and /or try to get the issue on the agenda.
DeleteYour approach is to seek a way to deal with them individually. We are raising the awareness of other Encinitas citizens--none of whom are thrilled with the poor oversight of this council.
DeleteThere is no accountability in a private meeting since they all make promises that they don't keep.
The way that they were elected in the first place was through broadcasting information through this blog and others.
Really, I thought it was by people busting ass going door to door, doing fundraisers and spreading the word individually. That and Jerome screwing himself putting up signs early. This blog did not get Lisa and Tony elected. You've got about 20 people posting on this blog day after day. There's a core group of activists in this city, 25-30 people. It's the people who started backing Lisa and Tony a year or more before the election that got them elected, that and Maggie's endorsement. The same people that push every time, this time with help from the prop A. folks. Most people could give a rats ass how the council performs, that's how we got stuck with Jerome for 3 terms. People like my neighbor, who don't even right it down when you tell them how to vote.
DeleteI will keeping saying it, if you don't like Lisa and Tony, you can vote them out, but who will you vote for in their stead? That's the key question, are you going to run, are you going to go door to door and do fundraisers, make phone calls? Or are you going to let Jerome and the big developers come back in. Come on big talkers on this blog, what's the plan? I want to hear a plan from all you pot bangers on how we're doing public protests or who we're prepping as alternate candidates...
Lisa dd have a PowerPoint image at her lecture that showed the vote totals. She pointed out that she had the highest total. There was no real need to do this in the context of her lecture.
DeleteThanks, 9:59, and everyone posting. This blog was a factor, and will be a factor in the next election. Twenty people of vision, of understanding and motivation, can have tremendous power to create positive change. We are all planting seeds, taking action in our own way. I am now telling me friends, whom I suggested vote for Lisa and Tony before, to "displace" Stocks; I'm glad we got Stocks out, but Lisa and Tony let us down . . .
DeleteHowever, short of a recall, we cannot get Lisa and Tony out of office next year. We can vote for someone who does have the courage and stamina to run. I hope that Teresa Barth will step down, not run again. She has said in the past that she supports two-term limits, so 8 year term limits for Council Members. That should also go on the ballot. Let's see if Teresa Barth will keep her word on that issue. She did not about replacing Glenn Sabine, were a new Couuncil majority elected, by our voting in Lisa and Tony.
Lisa ran on integrity, intelligence and respect. But whom does she respect? Herself? Obviously she respects Gus Vina. Council unanimously gave him an excellent rating in his recent evaluation.
At the initial subcommittee meeting on evaluations for the City Attorney and City Manager, Lisa went along with saying we would be allowed to participate online, in a satisfaction survey, as Encinitas citizens, which we were told was do-able by the Clerk, by using Voter Registration rolls to confirm addresses. Lisa said at the subcommittee meeting, "but everyone isn't registered to vote." I pointed out, at the Council Meeting which followed, that people who aren't registered to vote don't need to participate in the online surveys. Those surveys should be designed to reflect the opinions, and needs of Encinitas residents. Individuals, not corporate interests.
One correction. Here is the quote from the UT article:
********************
As for disappointments, she [Lisa Shaffer] said she was “sad at the divisive tone and misleading messaging” at the Proposition A special election last June. The proposition, passed by a bare majority, gives voters say on zoning matters.
*****************
One can see by the quotation marks, that the UT reporter was the one who is adding, "editorially" that the proposition passed by a bare majority. Lisa is quoted as complaining about the divisive tone and misleading messaging. The reporter takes that phrase out of context. We cannot really know, for certain, what Lisa said, whether she took any personal responsibility or not.
But our current Deputy Mayor has not publicly taken any responsibility, nor shown respect to the proponents of Prop A, during the City's campaign to defeat it, or after. Council, as a whole, did not show humility in their loss, nor show the public respect by taking responsibility for the misleading messaging engendered by Gus Vina's selection of Rutan and Tucker to write the so-called "independent report." Gus Vina took no responsibility, either, and neither has Council, in their excellent evaluation of our City Manager, for wrongly leaking the higher appraisal fee for Pacific View. That appraisal report was four million dollars higher than the lower report, which used LOCAL North County comps, not Los Angeles Comps. The differences were NOT the "ocean views," but the fact that the higher report was through an appraiser who used non-local comparisons.
Almost every person I know in Encinitas reads this blog often. They follow the thoughts when they vote.
DeleteSo five people?
DeleteSo 1:53, what was the takeaway on Lisa's lecture, what was the gist of it, 5 bullet points.
DeleteI oppose term limits, because we already have them. It's called your vote. Someone isn't doing the job, vote them out.
DeleteThe only problem is people don't vote. They'll come out in the general election, not in the off year. Next year is the off year. You will have half the people voting from 2012 to 2014.
Check the numbers here:
http://www.smartvoter.org/2010/11/02/ca/sd/
The bulk of people do not follow the blog, do no not care about politics in this town and probably don't even vote. You will have a hard time unseating an incumbent without an Andreen style smear campaign...
All of you over estimate the power of this blog or any blog. Earlier there was a poster calling for global population reduction, ie genocide of billions of people. Only one of you responded. You either approve of billions of death via ... Who know what or you don't give a shit about someone wanting you to be dead. You decide. My vote is none of you give a damn about anything except a few fucking roundabouts or a creek that leads no where.
DeleteBlogs do have power. They are a factor in disseminating information and opinion. They also can be a big factor in enabling deceptive tactics when a few sockpuppets or meatpuppets use them to try to twist public perception, to tweak and manipulate opinion with distortions of the truth. Politics can be dirty; we know that.
DeleteJerome Stocks was always the one who said he didn't believe in term limits. I do. That same excuse could be used for the President of the U.S. But our country passed a Constitutional Amendment so that a U.S. President can only be elected for two four year terms. That's how it should be for Council Members. I feel they also could serve as Mayor for three or four two year terms. Conceivably, a politician could then hold public office for up to 16 years, if people were willing to re-elect him or her, at the City level, in Encinitas. That's enough. Perhaps a combined term limit of 12 years would be preferable . . . But Council should have the discussion of putting some options on the ballot. If term limits are ok for Commissioners, they should be good for Council Members, as well.
I didn't read the post about global population reduction. It goes without saying that genocide is horrendous. Many recommend not responding to hate comments.
It only gives the anonymous cowards who make the hateful remarks a feeling of power when those being attacked respond. Some without a social conscience thrive on negative attention. The best way to defuse them is not to react to them in any way. Ignoring them is the wisest tactic, although that can be challenging. If the posts obviously go over the line of decency and legality, then WCV can be notified, so he can exercise his authority as moderator. It's a "free country" and he's free to moderate, as he sees fit.
I do support ZPG, zero population growth. It would help our planet, as a whole, if we could all CHOOSE to have only two children per family. If more are desired, they could be adopted, or fostered . . .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAF2GPT_79Q
DeletePopulation reduction by natural attrition and low fertility rates. Only a mentally ill person could conclude people advocating population reduction want it achieved through genocide.
DeleteBlogs do have power, but only as much as there is a sound basis for dialog and an honest exchange of ideas.
DeleteThe problem on this blog is there is a lot of name calling and not a lot of attempts to create cogent arguments based on information. Fred makes that attempt, I make that attempt, but a lot of the remaining posts go straight for the snark, or the personal opinion.
It's not a real give and take and opinion, it's a lot of shouting down to someone who doesn't hold your opinion, or not responding when someone makes a valid point.
To follow up on this, I made a point about why I didn't believe in Term Limits. The poster above then responded by making a comparison, whether intended or not, to Jerome.
DeleteI have never supported Jerome, or voted for him. My point about Term Limits involves voting and participation. The core of any election is voter turnout. Because people don't vote, the incumbents have a huge advantage due to name recognition. Despite the calls to "throw the bums out", a lot of people either won't vote, or vote for the incumbent.
That's how Jerome and Jim got to stay in for so long. They have the developers and bus. community behind them, with plenty of $.
So anyone opposing them better be really well organized, and have lots of $. And yes, like it or not, that was Lisa. Great campaign, anyway you slice it.
My feeling is if people are lame enough to vote in the same people in a city like Encinitas year after year, they get what they deserve. That's how I feel like Kristin. She just doesn't care, that's the vibe she puts off, her whole resume is this trumped up narrative of non-achievement.
By comparison, Lisa's resume is legit. Like it or not, she's had some positions with heft, where she's had to get it done.
But I digress, we don't need term limits. If you feel so strongly about ousting Lisa or whoever, work as hard as they did to make it happen. Talking on a blog is not the same thing. Lisa spent over a year making it happen. She had enough juice she carried Tony in with her. Now that's effort.
No to term limits, that's one of the reason this state is so screwed up, all the pols just keep shifting chairs at the state level. It worked better before...
I agree. Term limits are the worst thing to happen to democracy. If you hate special interests, you can't be in favor of term limits - you might as well just give the lobbyists the city checkbook because they're the only ones who end up with all the institutional knowledge.
Delete- The Sculpin
12:49 PM
DeleteLisa didn't get elected on her resume, effort, or personality. Many residents recommended her and Tony over that year. She needs to recognize that she didn't just float into office with only "her" effort.
Don't expect that recommendation the next election time.
Better vote for a Council member that will fire Sad Sac and hire a real City Manager that will address the needs of the City.
ReplyDeleteInstead Sad Sac has them dancing like toddlers playing ring around the rosy with this waste of time "Strategic Planning" (more like retirement planning for SS).
Man, I never thought he could pull the wool so far over their eyes. This council is just like the rest, loves to pat themselves on the back and not prioritize and address the real City issues.
Update, Sad Sac just made it one year closer to his retirement. Is Encinitas in any better shape today for establishing a realistic budget, fixing the pension and sports complex budget issues, and firing is rotten City Managers?
If your answer to the above questions is no, then it is time to vote for new City Council members.
Who is that council member going to be? Better start thinking about it, or talking to people, or you're going to see Jerome Stocks and his cronies right back on the council.
DeleteBang your pots!!
DeleteDrive them out!!
I can say without a shadow of a doubt many people troll this blog. So, I will say this anonymously, as some people don't believe in the First Amendment when it comes to them. First, we don't need a person that will say what the public wants to hear. We NEED a person that will follow their campaign promises. I have always thought that if any politician campaigned on an issue, and then reversed their position, should have to leave office. The public voted for Tony and Lisa because a lot of people thought they would bring ethics to City Hall and make sure Prop. A got the attention it deserved. They did not vote for them to find a way around these things. So what is ethical? Is it ethical to campaign on Prop. A and then change your mind? If new information became available, they should have let the public know and share why they changed their mind. Regarding Rossini Creek,we were assured that there would be no toxic waste from the Park. It would appear my the lawsuit, but the State of California, that we were lied to again. Who is responsible for this? In this case I don't think it is Vina. I believe it is Staff and Legal Counsel. It is possible that even Council didn't know what has been going on. Perhaps I am wrong on this one, but that is the way I am interpreting it now. How many times have we asked for an independent audit, only to be told we don't need one? Personally, I have asked numerous times from different Council members over the years. I always get the same answer, NO. Why? Couldn't tell you. So, next election let's make sure we pick a person that is somewhat educated, can understand complex ideas, concerns themselves with what is good for all of us, not jut a few, and thinks things through before speaking. For example, the ban on plastic bags. Nice idea, but how does it get enforced? Who is going to be the bag police? What will the fines be if we bring our own plastic bag. How much business will local businesses lose? Have these things been thought of, or looked in to? If so, where is that report? So many things that should be easy turn out to be so complicated, and no, it is not because everything moves so slowly, as Tony mentioned. It seems as if everyone, except ironically Mark and Kristin, is "stuck", so focusing on plastic bags becomes a "feel good" exercise, that probably isn't legal to begin with. These are just a few things to ponder.
DeleteI disagree with you, the elected official's "take" will always vary somewhat from their constituents.
DeleteFor me, the Prop A. thing and your resultant disappointment in Lisa and Tony's stand once they took office is dependent on the weight you gave it when you voted. People read into it what they wanted. My take, and what I heard Lisa say was, I will support the initiative on the ballot, but I may change my opinion later if I receive more information.
Other people saw her and Tony signing the ballot as 100% support for Prop A from now until the end of time. This is how our politics are now, you're either with me 100% of the time or I am against you 100% of the time.
We would all like changes instantly at city hall. I know I would. Not going to happen. Sorry, the reality is different. It's not right, but that's the way it goes. I too would like the audit, but I never thought that would happen. You'd probably have to have 5 new council members for that to happen.
On Rossini creek, I'm going to be following up on that. Somebody's head should role. Both Sabine and the Staff need to answer for that one.
Plastic bags: get cloth bags, keep in car. You're done and then you don't have to worry about it. Too much talk on this one, we've already gone down this path as a society, get on board and don't worry about the rest. We have more important issues.
I've been involved with city politics for about 16 years, nothing is ever smooth. Start thinking about who we can run against Kristin next time....
"My take, and what I heard Lisa say was, I will support the initiative on the ballot, but I may change my opinion later if I receive more information. "
DeleteThat may well be, but the "more information" she reicieved I'm afraid just wasn't so. There are still people who insist "5 stories was never on the radar for Encinitas" but that's just not so. The ERAC committee wasn't an uninfluential group but made serious, emphatic and unanimous recommendations to the council about building heights "in appropriate areas". ERAC required a lot of expensive time by involved locals (and a few non-locals we later learned). I still feel the entire council should have attended LTC's Prop A debate. Both Ehlers and Shackelton did a good job of representing each side.
I never heard Lisa say, either, "I will support the initiative on the ballot, but I may change my opinion later if I receive more information."
DeleteWhat I heard her say AFTER she was elected was that "I signed the petition, as I was advised to do, but with reservations, and later changed my mind when I received more information" (Rutan and Tucker report).
I was hoping I would hear some pot banging after my post....
ReplyDeletePut the pot over your head and I'll be the first to bang it!
ReplyDeleteGlad to feel the Thanksgiving love today....
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteDr. Lorri,
ReplyDeleteIf they lied to you, which it appears they did, this marginalizes the efforts of commissioners and others citizen volunteers who dedicate many hours of their time to serve the city.
There is always ample praise for volunteers, but they treat commissioners like a junior high student council. They give you a title but don't give you authority to make decisions. Another example is the Desert Rose situation. The Planning Commission spent many hours investigating this case and voted against the developer, and the council overturned it.
Lisa Shaffer does not want citizens involved in zoning issues and planning as Prop A has made possible, but the issues that the City has full responsibility for like Rossini Creek are a complete environmental and financial disaster. Where is our ethical politician when you need her? What will she and other council members do to address this issue since they do not want citizens involved. I guess they have nobody to blame but themselves and their own poor standards. Citizens asked for high standards of performance, and the council and city did not want that.
As a result, the City is on the record for being a massive polluter, and citizens are on the hook for hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of penalties.
DeleteLisa Shaffer famously told UT editor Logan Jenkins that grey and green issues were not in conflict with each other. This project is not "green," it is an environmental disaster. It is not "gray" since it has been a business nightmare.
Promoting cute slogans does not take the place of responsible supervision on these types of projects. Who is going to lose their jobs? If it isn’t a staff member or the City Manager, it may very well be Council. I think that they should have listened to all of those scientists and engineers in Cardiff who predicted that something like this would happen.
Oh please... You are upset about a piddly little creek ?? After all we are outlawing plastic bags and bottles, that shows we are green. COE is ego friendly.
DeleteSorry, still not buying the way you're pinning this all on Lisa. I don't necessarily agree with her take, but the project has been underway for years. And FYI, the development on Hymettus was an env. disaster, and the prior council didn't give a rats ass about that.
DeleteResidents had to vacate their homes thanks to the lack of watering and all the pesticides that were dug up by the builder...
Not true that the project has been underway for years. It's true that the property was bought in 2001, then sat there for many years. But the financing for construction of the park was approved in July 2012. Lisa was sworn in as a council member in December 2012, so most of the actual work which led to the violation was done under her watch. Was she unaware of what was going on with the city's largest public works project ever? The total cost of the project will reach $60-$70 million, $19 million just for the construction. There was a troubling lack of attention here.
DeleteRight, but you're naming her and her alone, not Tony, Kristin, Mark and Teresa. What was there awareness level? Let's be fair, I have no problem nailing all 5 of them, if that's the case. I have no idea.
DeleteClearly you don't like Lisa, you have that right, but we have 5 city council people, not just 1.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteNot to be crass, but they clearly stand for making money for their firm, period. Positions on issues seem to switch based on who they're hired to represent. Sorry, but Marco to me is not to be trusted.
DeleteI would point you to his bio below, where it details his work for environmentalists, developers, and now bars and restaurants seeking a change in their permits!
Deletehttp://www.coastlawgroup.com/marco-a-gonzalez/
What happened to Dr. Lori's post? Wait she took down 2 posts. Why?
DeleteOne thing about posting under one's own login (in blue), as Dr. Lorri did, and as I now am, one can then go back and delete posts, if we decide that's the wisest course, or just to make edits, and respost. I wish I would have read Dr. Lorri's original posts, though, before she deleted.
DeleteThose posting anonymously don't have the option of deleting. But someone could ask WCV to delete his or her own anonymous post, by e-mailing him.
If you say so...
DeleteIf you keep in mind not post anything you'd later regret or be ashamed of , you don't have to worry about it...
DeleteWe all make typos, though. On this blog, one can edit by deleting and reposting, with corrections. It's not necessarily that anyone is ashamed of something posted.
DeleteI don't think we have to live in regret if we learn from our mistakes. Most successes or maybe all success involves trial and error.
You mean like this:
ReplyDeleteMarco also has extensive experience representing responsible developers and small businesses in land use entitlement matters. With more than 15 years spent fighting development projects, clients are sometimes surprised to find out Marco has successfully entitled major hotel developments, marina expansions, residential subdivisions, and industrial/commercial facilities. Marco is one of very few San Diego attorneys respected by community, business, labor, and governmental stakeholders to drive collaborative land use and development processes to regulatory approval. Examples of successful approvals of large scale multi-party projects include the Chula Vista Bayfront Master Plan and City of San Diego Water Reuse Study.
Throughout the County, Marco also represents restaurants, bars, and nightclubs seeking permits and permit modifications from the California Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control.
If you say you are ethical long enough you might start to believe it. Actions speak louder than words and everyone knows who turned out to be unethical. Probably has designs on new kitchen appliances as well.
ReplyDeleteCity employees, certain people from law firms post, look for snarky comments like "ya think" as giveaways.
ReplyDeleteLynn: I tool my posts down because I was asked to by a person who trolls this blog.
ReplyDeleteI would say go ahead an post those types of comments anonymously. Marco Gonzales is a legitimate topic for Encinitas, whether he and his firm like it or not.
DeleteI agree Dr. Lori. I read your post and there was nothing in there that was inflammatory or in any way could get you sued.
DeleteAccording to Handle on the Law, anybody can sue anybody for anything. But he doesn't always tell the truth. Opps, hope I don't get sued!
DeleteIt all depends what you say. It's true, you can always sue, but you may not win would probably be more accurate...
Delete4:24
DeleteYeah, I think that's his gist when says that. Entertaining lawyer sometimes, but his sarcasm is second to none if you ever listen to his show on 640 am Saturdays (I think it is).
After the horrible way in which these "new" incumbents have been treated, not to mention the manner in which the "old" incumbents were treated, why would anyone short of a Komodo dragon -skinned political operative ever consider running for any elected office in Encinitas?!?!?
ReplyDelete- The Sculpin
Come on Sculpin, Jerome is a complete tool, he never was cheated in his abuse of speakers or people opposing his viewpoint. Like any elected official, I had moments where I agreed with him, but they were few and far between. Same goes for Danny and his shenanigans down at the bank.
DeleteThe "new incumbents" of Shaffer and Kranz and the "old incumbents" of Stocks, and Dalager, and at the end, Bond, and Barth, have mistreated the public. They are not in office for photo ops and to have accolades heaped upon them. They are to be our public servants. They have not served us well. They have not done the MOST THEY CAN, NOT THE LEAST, another broken promise of Mayor Barth.
ReplyDeleteOld and new incumbents should have reported the findings and censures re Rossini Creek as they were being "called out" by the SD Regional Water Quality Control Board. Instead the public was left in the dark. Corrections were not made. We were led to believe that everything was "hunky dory" and that the Park would be finished on time, with no hang-ups.
Also, traditionally, we only have one SDWD meeting per month. It has been held at the same time, 6 p.m., as the regular CC Meetings. Then, Lisa Shaffer came up with the idea of starting it earlier. She wants to put her "stamp" on everything, whether the changes are wanted, or not. I objected, because most people cannot get to City Hall by 5 p.m. Tony Kranz said, "let's compromise." So it was moved to 5:30, with a stipulation that change would come back for review.
Well, when it did come back, last month at the SDWD meeting, with barely anyone in attendance at 5:30, Board of Director Barth suddenly said (WITHOUT THIS OPTION BEING ON THE AGENDA, IT WAS TO BE A REVIEW OF THE 5:30 START TIME), let's move it to 5:00 p.m., so Council can have a break between meetings. She also inferred that as there were so many closed sessions, Council especially needed a break before the regular Council Meeting. We are having more closed session meetings now, then ever, under incumbent Barth.
This is NOT encouraging public participation. Glenn Pruim, who is also the public works managing director for SDWD should have given a report on the issues of Rossini Creek, as they relate to the Hall Property Park and the Water Quality Control Board. Our Council and staff can and should do better. Mark Muir and Kristin Gaspar did vote against changing the start time of SDWD meetings to 5 P.M. I could not be at that meeting by 5. Changing the time to 5, when even less people will be able or want to attend is just one more example of our Mayor, Deputy Mayor and Councilmember Kranz doing the least they can, not the most.
Because of all these mistakes under the "new majority," and because we were all so disgusted, before, that Teresa Barth kept being skipped over in her turn in the rotation for mayor, and because Lisa, Teresa and Tony all supported the traditional rotation, and were planning on making Kristin Gaspar Mayor last time around, Kristin Gaspar should be the last appointed Mayor. She and Mark Muir also made the right vote on the Leichtag land-use issue.
Disagree. One year in to an office holder's tenure does not equate with 12 years in Stocks case, or 16-20 in Bond's case (It sure seemed like 20).
DeleteI for one like them moving up the water board meeting. Those of us who have jobs can't stay until 11 at night for some of the council meetings. It's a common sense move to try and shorten the council meetings.
To me, a lot of this has gotten way too personal. I'm giving Lisa and Tony the rest of their term to do what they can, they'll I'll review and vote one way or the other. And I'm going to try and work with them, less we get the return of Stocks and Bonds.
Gaspar refused to be mayor if you call,she said I am to busy thank you!.the water board advisied the city in January of this year it was being investigated.About three weeks ago they advised the city the contractor was in violation.I'm told that his insurance will cover the fine.Further more this violation was not on going and been remedied.
DeleteYes, Kristin Gaspar did decline to be mayor. Part of that was about the We Love Encinitas brouhaha.
DeleteAlso, there was some positioning going on, and still is, about who will be the last appointed mayor, in the year that precedes our first elected mayor. I'm so glad it will be for a two year term. I feel that we elected our council reps for four years. They should not be running for mayor in the middle of their two year terms. Otherwise, we should have ALL councilmembers and the mayor's positions be for two year terms. Get the bad apples out of the barrel ASAP.
Of course politics gets personal. That's the nature of politics, which is all about power plays, power changes, and control of public resources, including money. But I have said before, there are politics in any relationship, including the workplace, and friends and family associations. Politics, to me, is about shifting power.
I'd like to ask Lisa what does integrity mean to her? To me, part of it is showing humility, accepting personal responsibility, having compassion for others by listening to and attempting to understand their perceptions.
Integrity involves doing unto others as we would have them do unto us. I have found Lisa Shaffer to be defensive, and not able to understand, or not willing to consider those who give reasonable, logical arguments that are contrary to her own opinions. I certainly don't consider her to be an expert on ethics, in action.
I'd be very interested to see if an insurance company does cover the fine. Is it the contractor's insurance company, through the CLB? Or did the city take out a policy on the development of the Hall Property?
The violation was NOT remedied, per the report and the proposed fine. Apparently there is to be a hearing before the Water Quality Control Board? Glenn Pruim, through the City Manager, should provide a public report/agenda item ASAP.
Just as one year is not enough time, in your eyes, 11:36, to judge Lisa for staff's and council's failures, it is also not enough time for her to have gained experience as an elected rep to now state she's running for mayor? Did she mean she wants to be the next appointed mayor? Her lack of experience as an elected leader, and the numerous errors she's been part of and partially responsible for, would belie her ability to be an effective elected Mayor for 2014-2016. She could better serve out her four years, as we elected her to do, and then run for mayor, if she wishes, in 2016.
And 11:36, we didn't have to choose between going to 11 p.m. or setting back the meetings to 5 p.m. You are never at the SDWD meetings anyway, so why should you care? The City could go to a schedule of having a Council Meeting four Wednesday's a month, and has also cut back on the time allowed for staff reports, including SDWD reports.
DeleteThe policy of not repeating, verbatim, what's in the staff report should have been applied to the Mayor's Special "looking back" presentation, as well. We didn't need to listen to that "advertisement" for about an hour when we had a very full "action" schedule that night. At least the public was allowed to comment on the patting staff and Council on the back, presentation.
Nothing was said about ways the city could improve, only all the fabulous accomplishments . . .
Uh, you're correct, I'm not at the water meetings. But hopefully by moving those to an earlier time, we can move faster on the regular meetings, which often run very late.
DeleteWhen one gets up before 6 to go work, anything past 8pm is getting late, just FYI. I agree that there are lots of delays in the meetings. I liked Jim Bond as Mayor for one thing: He really pushed to keep the meetings moving.
It would also be helpful if certain speakers used prepared remarks, strove for succinctness, and didn't speak on every issue, respectfully. Everyone has a right to speak, I recognize that, but be mindful of everyone's time and schedule.
What exactly was Lisa's statement on running for Mayor. Haven't seen that in her emails or at council.
DeleteI heard Lisa said she was running for mayor at her Miracosta lecture last Friday. I wasn't present, however.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteI am correcting my misstatement, above, because I have now been told, directly, that Lisa did not say she was running for mayor at the General Election. She has shared with me that she did not commit either way, whether she would or would not run, but was explaining the process.
DeleteI regret my error, and apologize for any misunderstanding or misinformation. I do stand by previous statements that those Councilmembers we elect for four years should not run after only two years from "safe seats."
Every elected official in Encinitas should have to choose between running for Council or running for Mayor, or not running again, in my opinion, although state law may allow otherwise. Again, this is a matter of discretion, unless Encinitas chooses to enact city code that is more restrictive than State Government Code, which is also do-able.
My sister, Lorri, has always been one to put her name on things, even when I tell her not to. She was a rebel in the 60's and obviously still is. I love her more than words can say. I will say that I was with her when she received the text she is referring to, asking her to take her posts down. She did it because she felt it was a way to make amends to a couple of people who are not so fond of her these days. It was not a Council member or a Staff member, or Vina or your City Attorney. It was someone outside of City Hall. My sister is not feeling all that well these days, and she wants to go out without remorse, if she can. However, she is not a quitter, and she will fight until she cannot. I have counseled her to post anonymously many times, and yet she still posts her name. I admire her and at the same time, when she agonizes over the snarky comments, I tell her it's her own fault. I have to get back to work now, but all I can say, is she has always loved Cardiff and Encinitas and has worked hard to do what she thinks is right. Now, that may not always be what everyone else, including her family, thunks is right, but if you had met my Irish father and grandfather, you would know her a lot better. I enjoy reading this blog even though I live elsewhere. I just couldn't resist this one post.
ReplyDeleteI've a friend working on this project and he tells me the city inspector found the violation and then he notified the water board It appears the city turned themselves in .
ReplyDeleteGood for him, why no transparency then with the public??
DeleteGood question 5:26. If the City turned themselves in, certainly they could inform we, the public, about how ethical they are. This would have been a great opportunity for it.
DeleteIf the city "turned itself in," why did they wait to release this information until after Sabine and Vina's evaluations?
DeleteOh right! Gus' hands were tied and he couldn't release this information because it is so hard to get anything done in this city and the council forced him to take a pay raise!
On March 10, 2005, the San Diego Reader ran a very revealing article. The title of it was the question "Is Cheri an Axe Murderer?" by Joe Deegan / City Lights. The story was so distubing for one man, he called the Reader to threaten them with a lawsuit if they did not forever remove it from their online archives. The Reader caved in; took the story down and today, no one can Google "Is Cheri an Axe Murderer". Incredibly, I learned from the author of the article that it was Cheri's own court appointed defense lawyer who failed at her trial who wanted the story deleted.
ReplyDeleteFred,
DeleteCheri's story is horrifying and tragic. It can still be found here (large pdf) and I encourage everyone to read it.
WCV
Fred, I've read the article, before. It's too bad that the Reader bowed down to the someone threatening a lawsuit. We are losing our freedom of the press, as it errodes away through frivilous threats of litigation and actual lawsuits designed to limit free speech and freedom of assembly, too.
DeleteI'm sorry for the tragic miscarriage of justice, re your sister, and now what appears to be a cover-up. I'm not surprised you couldn't get any relief through Bonnie Dumanis. I'd never vote for her again, for DA, or any other office. I naively thought because she had been a judge, she would be more equitable. Not so. She backs "the old boys club" which includes women, all the way.
Lorri, we all are hoping you will be feeling much better soon. I'm grateful for your service and your encouraging, inspiring spirit.
That someone threatening a lawsuit was a lawyer. They obviously did print it, but he got them to remove the online version.
DeleteThanks to WC for posting. FYI, if you haven't seen West of Memphis, or the other docs on the West Memphis 3 case, they're all highly instructive on witch hunts, lack of evidence and coercion of testimony...
Appreciate the empathy. Long story short - meth is a good thing to avoid; the founding fathers were on to something with that free speech ideal and falsified forensics should never be the foundation of an arrest, indictment or conviction. That said, WCV, you are an e-wizard finding that PDF! You must have looked the whole issue up by date, as key links typed into their archive search won't bring it up. Meanwhile thanks for the link.
Delete12:50, A lot of us love the doc and wish her the best!
ReplyDeleteSeconded. I wish her the best and have no trouble accepting that justification. Hoping and praying for the best....
DeleteI also wish Dr. L a speedy recovery. I hope it is nothing serious.
DeleteDr. Lorri is and has been a friend to our community, and to so many individuals, including Russell and me, in sickness and in health.
DeleteI am truly sorry that so much power has been taken from the various commissions, by previous Councilmembers. Unfortuantely, this has continued under current Council, Gus Vina, and Lisa R., Director of Parks and Rec.
Adding two "at large" commissioners to what will now be the Traffic and Safety Commission throws the balance of power off. There should be one Commissioner, per community, as on the Planning Commission. Otherwise, you are also decimating the legal standing and strength, the discretion, of the Traffic Commission. I'll be objecting to the ordinance that Lisa, Teresa and Tony are pushing.
We are all dying. Some just faster than others…. Appreciate life and don't waste it like KLCC members…..
ReplyDeleteKLCC = Keep Leucadia's Community Character
DeleteDon't worry we are enjoying life, including by working to protect our quality of life.
The rest of America knows it as Keep Leucadia Crappy Club.
DeleteWith Lynn running for President, but she can't get enough people interested to vote.
encinitas is coming up. Its just a matter of time under Sad Sac's lack of leadership…. but he may get his $200,000 per year forever, so what does he care?
ReplyDeletehttp://stream.wsj.com/story/latest-headlines/SS-2-63399/SS-2-395940/
Maybe by Lisa's own personal definition, she is an ethical person. I think it is clear that she works hard.
ReplyDeleteThe problem is that going back on one's word and turning her back on the voters who got her where she's at is a character issue. It is also not that endearing that she takes complete credit for all of the votes she received, without giving credit to the endorsements from Maggie and others. At the same time, she plays the victim and has taken no responsibility for turning her back on the voters.
She will have to work for years to counteract the negative messages that she has given her base. There is a huge trust issue to overcome with all of the council.
I can agree with the assertion that it's a character issue. I think when we're talking Ethics in a political situation, it's more in the vein of Dallager taking free appliances and trading favors at the bank.
DeleteShe did work harder than any candidate I've ever worked with in this city, I will give her that.
If people don't feel they're receiving credit, that may hurt her down the line, because a lot of the politics in this town boil down to the personal.
I for one will follow her votes and actions in office, and go off of that...
A judge( who will someday receive a govt pension) says Detroit can not declare bankruptcy. City workers all across the land rejoice.... Loser Leucadian and COE workers doing cartwheels down 101 in happiness.
ReplyDeleteTheir pay and pensions assured, look for city workers to be more lazy and condescending to the public.
Nope. The opposite.
Deletehttp://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/03/detroit-bankruptcy-protection-judge-rules
WCV
Highly Recommend reading, from the Detroit Free Press
Deletehttp://www.freep.com/interactive/article/20130915/NEWS01/130801004/Detroit-Bankruptcy-history-1950-debt-pension-revenue
Also recommended:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.us.penguingroup.com/nf/Book/BookDisplay/0,,9781594205347,00.html
From the Washington Post:
ReplyDeleteDetroit will become the largest city in U.S. history to declare bankruptcy after a federal judge ruled Tuesday the city had met the legal criteria to win protection from its creditors.
U.S. Bankruptcy Judge Steven Rhodes delivered the 140-page ruling after four months of legal wrangling between a state-appointed emergency manager and unions worried about the bankruptcy’s impact on pensions. Rhodes presided over a nine-day trial to determine whether the city met the requirements for bankruptcy protection.
“This once proud and prosperous city can’t pay its debts. It’s insolvent. It’s eligible for bankruptcy,” Rhodes said from the bench. “At the same time, it also has an opportunity for a fresh start.”
Detroit, once a city of 1.8 million and the home of the American auto industry, has suffered a long descent into financial crisis. The city was home to just 713,000 people, according to the 2010 Census, a mere shadow of its post-war apex. Huge pension costs and a recession that sent American automakers into their own financial tailspins exacerbated Detroit’s budget gaps.
On July 18, with Detroit facing an estimated $18 billion in debt and liabilities, it became the largest city in American history to file for bankruptcy protection. Almost 40 cents of every dollar the city collected was used to pay down debt, an amount the city said would skyrocket to 65 cents on the dollar without bankruptcy protection, according to the Associated Press. Detroit said it owed money to more than 100,000 creditors.
Under Chapter 9, the city’s emergency manager, Kevin Orr, will explore ways to pay off some of its debt while restoring some social services, all under court supervision.
Orr will be able to consider pension cuts as part of his final proposal, Rhodes ruled. But Rhodes said he would only allow the cuts if the final reorganization is fair, the Detroit Free Press reported. Unions protested that bankruptcy would threaten the pensions of retirees and current employees.
At a news conference, Orr said selling the city’s art collection was still an option. He said pension cuts would be necessary to emerge from bankruptcy, but that he would work to mitigate the impact.
“We’re trying to be very thoughtful, measured and humane,” Orr said.
An attorney for the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees, Sharon Levine, told the Associated Press after the ruling that the union would appeal the decision to the 6th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Cincinnati.
“There’s going to be a lot of pain for a lot of different people. But in the long run, the future will be bright,” outgoing Mayor Dave Bing (D) said at a news conference after the ruling.
Michigan’s constitution doesn’t allow reducing pensions already owed to public workers, except in cases of bankruptcy.
Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder (R) supported Detroit’s move. Snyder appointed Orr to oversee the city during the proceedings.
“Authorizing the emergency manager to seek federal bankruptcy protection was a difficult decision, but it was the last viable option to restore the city and provide Detroit’s 700,000 residents with the public services they need and deserve,” Snyder said in a statement. “We know that Detroit’s comeback is already in motion.”
Reid Wilson covers state politics and policy for the Washington Post's GovBeat blog. He's a former editor in chief of The Hotline, the premier tip sheet on campaigns and elections, and he's a complete political junkie. Reid is a Seattle native and a graduate of The George Washington University. He lives on Capitol Hill with his wife, Veronica. Get GovBeat in your inbox! Sign up here for our twice-weekly newsletters.
Also on GovBeat
South Dakota Gov. Daugaard won't rule out future Medicaid expansion
Thanks NAFTA.
DeleteDr. Lori-
ReplyDeleteDo you think the failure of Detroit is at all linked to the failed socialist/communist policies and tactics of Saul Alinky and his followers who proposed dividing voters long lines of class, race and gender to promote and elect communist/socialist leaders who would take wealth from private citizens and redistribute that wealth to elected elites, the state and state workers?
I am just curious if you see any connection or correlation that the failed redistributive 'power to the people' policies of the 60 and 70's have actually turned out to benefit what looks to me like kleptocrats.
You mean the same Saul Alinsky that William F. Buckley described as an organizational genius? The same Saul Alinsky who's first organizing efforts were in the worst neigborhoods of Chicago - the back of the yards - a testament to raw capitalism. The same Saul Alinsky that said:
Delete"I've never joined any organization—not even the ones I've organized myself. I prize my own independence too much. And philosophically, I could never accept any rigid dogma or ideology, whether it's Christianity or Marxism. One of the most important things in life is what Judge Learned Hand described as 'that ever-gnawing inner doubt as to whether you're right.' If you don't have that, if you think you've got an inside track to absolute truth, you become doctrinaire, humorless and intellectually constipated. The greatest crimes in history have been perpetrated by such religious and political and racial fanatics, from the persecutions of the Inquisition on down to Communist purges and Nazi genocide."
That Saul Alinsky?
- The Sculpin
Read the article below:
Deletehttp://www.freep.com/interactive/article/20130915/NEWS01/130801004/Detroit-Bankruptcy-history-1950-debt-pension-revenue
Detroit was failing as far back as 50 years ago. Saul Alinsky doesn't have anything to do with it, in the direct sense.
I should say "starting to fail", although there were some times when they actually had money. It's not just about pensions in Detroit, read the article, and learn something...
DeleteI mean the communist Saul Alinsky who advocated the overthrow of America while lining his pockets full of riches. I mean the Saul Alinsky who climbed into bed with mobsters and criminals to organize the poor to allow himself to proft. Much like Bill Ayers and Bernadine Dohrn now living in $2M dollar penthouse in Chicago while the poor they claim to represent have only grown more poor and less educated while Ayers, Dorhn and their compatriots Jesse Jackson, Reverend Wright and Rahm Emmmauel are millionaires. I mean the Saul Alinsky who wrote in Rules for Radicals "the issue is never the issue" and the "ends justify the means" - like lying and telling people "If you like your health plan you can keep your health plan". I mean the Saul Alinsky who used tactics of dividing races, classes and gender and using hate to gain political power and to enrich himself on the backs of those he claimed he represented. The Saul Alinsky who wanted government to control people, not people to control government.
ReplyDeleteOh yea, about those Unions in Detroit that have robbed everyday citizens of resources, education, services while enriching elected elites and the state by redistributing private resources. It is interesting that those with penthouses in say Manhattan or horse ranches in rural land might promote communist policies of high density housing and redistribution like Alinsky did and Ayers does provided they get to keep theirs.
How is Chicago doing these days Scuplin? Pension problems, yes. Crime, yes, Failing schools, yes, Failing services, yes. That Alinsky, the one from Chicago, the one known to me as a communist, that's who I mean.
Wow, that's quite the diatribe against Alisnky, er Obama, er unions, er Chicago, er city workers.
Deletehttp://billmoyers.com/segment/bill-moyers-essay-the-real-saul-alinsky/
Why are you so afraid of Alinsky?
Even Newt steals from Alinsky....
DeleteAlinsky used tactics of dividing races,classes and gender and hate to gain political power? Sounds like he's the original Teabagger.
DeleteThe Cabezon
That would be the right's take on Alinsky. The same right who lost the last two elections, with outdated, tired, lame candidates. The Republicans need to get their act together and stop all the race baiting and get a program out there that people are interested in.
DeleteMesnwhile, here in the golden state, lawmakers in Sacramento have approved a pay raise for themselves. Can the enc city council be far behind???
ReplyDeleteToday's WSJ page A16, Illinois Fake Pension Fix paragraph 6. " the Illinois version gives the state control over.... Let's the state raid individual accounts at anytime.
ReplyDeleteThis law allows the state of Illinois to raid private monies to buck up their poison spending. No money is safe ever.
10:30-I have no idea as I am not an economist. Guess I will let others weigh in.
ReplyDeleteNew Mayor to be sworn in next Tuesday at City Hall for those interested.
ReplyDeleteSchaffer is the new mayor??? Oh shit!! She as dumb as a door nail....
DeletePlease don't insult doornails.
DeleteTuesday? I thought it would be done at the Wednesday Council Meeting? Thanks for letting us know. Will the meeting begin at 6 p.m.?
ReplyDeleteI think the meeting is tomorrow, listed as a special meeting on the city website.
ReplyDeleteWow! Now Encinitas has integrity. Ethical bar opening soon!
ReplyDeleteEvery post has the exact same 100 comments. You should copy and paste the comment section from the last post into the next post to save time.
ReplyDeleteThat's because nothing changes in this town, same cast of idiots year after year.
DeleteI am totally confused. The meeting tomorrow eve. says it is a meeting about the Strategic Plan, at least from what I can decipher. I had on my calendar that the meeting for the new Mayor was next Tuesday, but I don't see it on the City Calendar. However, supposedly the Parks and Rec. Commission is meeting Dec. 17th but we were told we would be "dark". So, who knows what is going on and when?
ReplyDeleteSad Sac doesn't care as long as he gets his $200,000 in a few more years after having City Council chase their tail in this ridiculous "Strategic Planning/Sad Sac retirement planning" exercise.
ReplyDeleteSiiighhhh…...
He gets over $200,000 a year forever. That $1,000,000 every 5 years of retirement just for one guy.
ReplyDeleteThen u got gouts like Muir also pulling in a million every 6 years OC retirement.
No wonder our city is broke.
I got an idea.... Let's just strategic plan!
The new mayor will be sworn in on the 10th according to Teresa Barth, who I emailed. Below is what she said:
ReplyDeleteYes it is the 10th. Teresa
Only seven more days until Barth is out as Mayor.
ReplyDeleteIt has been a long 12&1/2 months.
Lorri, the Calendar on the City's homepage is showing a special meeting, now, for next Tuesday, Dec. 10. The agenda won't come up, only the one for tomorrow, by clicking on current agenda, so far, for me.
ReplyDeleteTomorrow's meeting is also a special council meeting, for Part II of the Transit Workshops for the Strategic Planning process.
How many times does Vina have to repeat the strategic plan power point. Does he think the council is anal retentive.
ReplyDeleteThe Dec. 10 special city council meeting appears on the calendar on the city's home page, but not on the council's own page for upcoming events.
ReplyDeleteNo official info or agenda is available for the special city council meeting on Dec. 10.
So much for transparency and visibility under Barth's reign.
Maybe they don't want anyone there to witness the transfer of power to Shaffer.
More like bad code, or they forgot to post it.
DeleteHave you ever noticed they forget a lot of things? Misplace files or better yet, just one vital page from a file?
DeleteOr a conspiracy to deny the public access to information. So someone would have to be telling the web developer to deliberately remove one page of a report. Then you have his or her boss telling them to do it, and someone on council telling them to do it? And yet no one has ever finked on the situation. You tell me....
DeleteSounds a lot like the Warren Commission report on how Kennedy was killed. Not too many people think it was a lone gunman. Yet 50 years later they still don't really know.
Delete9:17 AM
DeleteWhat web developer? Posting isn't farmed out. The IT department posts some things while individual departments post their own items. And, yes, items or a page can be removed by the department poster before it goes onto the city website. By the way, the city's IT department is a multi-million dollars cost.
9:14, I'm talking about physical records, not electronic. Examples abound, just watch the Desert Rose video to see the records issues residents had with the city.
DeleteAccording to the Brown Act, Special Meetings only require 24 hour posted notice. Under Mayor Barth, we're being given 72 hour notice, generally. However, this is just at her discretion. She, Lisa and Tony didn't follow through with a Sunshine Ordinance, which could have made three days notice for special meetings mandatory in Encinitas. Council would still have the option of scheduling an "emergency meeting," in a true emergency, even with a local sunshine ordinance in place that would upgrade our city's transparency.
DeleteWhile there are at times truly special council meetings, any meeting in addition to the formal meeting calendar adopted each year is labeled a Special Meeting. For years the Council has had a special meeting in December, usually on a Tuesday, so they can select the Mayor and Deputy Mayor and/or seat newly elected council members. I assume that this is so the regular council meeting the next day can proceed without interruption.
DeleteThe City website routinely posts a meeting agenda the week before the meeting. The December 10 agenda is up. The December 11 agenda will probably be posted today.
The Brown Act defines Special Meetings as those with 24 hours notice. The City defines them as those Council Meetings that are not "regularly" calendared, on the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th Wednesdays of the month, OR not held at City Hall.
DeleteIn the past, the City routinely gave EVERY special council meeting AT LEAST 72 hours notice EXCEPT for Special Meeting Closed Sessions, which only got 24 hours notice. Under Barth, as Mayor, that has changed, although the change is DISCRETIONARY, because a Sunshine Ordinance has not been CODIFIED, despite repeated, broken, campaign promises.
La Mesa, where Glenn Sabine is also City Attorney had years ago changed to giving special meeting closed sessions AT LEAST 72 hours notice, as was informed to me by the La Mesa City Clerk, when I called and spoke to her, personally. She informed me that La Mesa "had issues" about notice for closed sessions, in the past.
The Brown Act discusses closed sessions as being part of regular council meetings, and therefore requiring, by law, 72 hours notice. As far as I know, only the cities of La Mesa and Encinitas have EVERY SINGLE CLOSED SESSION CATEGORIZED AS A SPECIAL MEETING.
Just as Council, the Mayor and the City Manager, along with the City Attorney have the DISCRETION to give more than 24 hours notice for ALL special meetings, they also have the discretion to allow part or all of the City Manager and City Attorney evaluations, including public review of their work plans, to be done in OPEN SESSION. There is NO actual threat of exposure to litigation by the CA and CM against the City.
The law firm of Liebert, Cassidy and Whitmore, who allegedly gave our Risk Management Director direction about not "soliciting" public input," re evaluations (documentation was never provided, despite repeated public info requests) as well as the City have been provided legal precedent, which PROVES that there is no exposure to litigation through solicitation of public input, by specific citations of case law delivered through General Counsel of Californians Aware, Terry Francke.
More Vina pressure and council acquiescence -
ReplyDeleteCouncil agendas are no longer officially available by 3:00 pm on Thursdays. City website shows the following:
Copies of Council agenda documents are available for review after 3:00 p.m. on the Friday before the scheduled Wednesday Council meeting.
Thanks council for more dark-sided hide public information as much as possible.
Today's WSJ page A15 talks about the IMF tax on the wealthy as it " offers significant revenue potential at relatively low costs".
DeleteThey are coming after YOUR money. This is govt set to steal what they cannot earn. Like thieves in the night they take what they want. Defile them.
Again, you would have to know everything about the web developer, when the information is given to the web developer etc. More than likely, they haven't updated the text on the page to reflect a later posting date.
DeleteAnd yes, I'm a web developer by trade. And no I don't work for the city or any gov. organization.
On a website, you either have a total commitment to timeliness and accuracy, or you don't...
For all you know, they farm out the work. The copyright statement is two years old..
http://www.ci.encinitas.ca.us/index.aspx?page=231
9:05 you are correct. They are coming after your money, quality of life and freedom. Saul Alinsky taught his pupils well. The issue is never the issue and the ends justify the means. Alsinky and Linda Fithian have been organizing to gain political power. Interesting how the IMF head has close ties to Chicago.
DeleteTrying to tie this all in to Alinsky would be like the left trying to tie everything since Reagan into highball Scotch connoisseur Bill Buckley's teachings, er ravings, er mumblings.
DeleteAlinsky's teaching's are simple, how to organize people effectively when you don't have a lot of money. The right needs a scapegoat, because lord knows they don't want to admit they were napping at the switch and failed to harness the internet and its fundraising abilities two straight election cycles.
Here's the equation: Bad Candidates= election loss. The same with the Democrats losing to Bush twice, why? Because Kerry and Gore could pass pass as cigar store Indians. Terrible candidates, no oomph, charisma. And still the trumped up swift boat stuff was needed to keep Kerry out, despite no veracity to those claims.
Take heart, there's only 3 years left in Obama's term, you have that time to cook up new conspiracy theories for Hillary, and quit using Whitewater, that's been used up...LOL...
Bengazi. Oh what's wrong with me," it doesn't matter".
DeleteBut every other week, we get the Agenda Reports for CC Meetings on Thursday, because the City is "off" on alternating Fridays!
DeleteAccording to the footer, these guys built it...
ReplyDeletehttps://www.visioninternet.com/about-us/contact-us
9:21 AM
ReplyDeleteThe city's IT department takes care of posting internally.
Then somebody's slacking. But like I say, you either have the commitment to timely updates ALL the time, or you don't. It appears the city doesn't. But can the conspiracy theories.
ReplyDeleteAll this is happening on Vina's watch. Either he is incompetent in running a city government or he falls under the conspiracy theory. Council gave him an excellent in job performance, sooooo -
DeleteRight, but the last two city managers were just as bad, if not worse. So where do we go from here?
DeleteThere is an obvious multiplier effect of ineptitude and stupidity at the City.
ReplyDeleteIt goes something like this:
An unqualified manager hires dumb people to work under him/her. Since they hire people who lack the qualifications to do the job and are no threat to the dumb manager, they hire consultants to do the dumb staff member and dumb managers jobs. When it turns out predictably poorly because the managers and staff are even too dumb to work with consultants, or they look for people of their own level, the dumb City Manager brings in new, dumb directors and calls them his "Cabinet." The dumb council does not want to make decision, so they turn everything over to the dumb manager who says that he is unable to do his job without hiring 4 more dumb directors who each cost 6-figures.
When they all keep making mistakes, the dumb City Manager explains why things aren't working. It is those 28 obstructionists who are to blame! Therefore, records must be hidden and destroyed and made available later and later, so that on their days off from their own jobs, the 28 obstructions will have less time to identify all of the mistakes that hundreds of city employees and staff make but were not able to cover up, or did not even recognize as terrible work since everyone at the city has the same standards.
You forgot one thing - none of it could be possible without the "dumb" voters!
DeleteI do have to had it to you, though - you've got a he$$ of a broad brush!!!!
- The Sculpin
4:17 is incredibly accurate. Funny thing is it seems so unbelievable no one could believe it to be true. But it really is. Sadly so it is exactly how things are.
DeleteCity Manager Gus Vina should be playing the starring role in the Grinch who stole Christmas.
ReplyDeleteMistakes we made - thinking Shaffer and Kranz represented reform.
ReplyDeleteIn most normal situations, people assume that others are telling the truth. Boy were we ever snowed by our new council majority!
ReplyDeleteI don't....
DeleteShaffer appears to be in la-la land. Too long in the Ivory Tower..
ReplyDeleteKranz is "impotent" now - he a big wheel! Show me de cash!
Gasper is invisible - worthless.
Muir is $tock$..
Barth is Prom Queen - just wave and smile.
This city is in trouble!