Monday, October 7, 2013

In praise of politicians, and in condemnation of citizens who hold them accountable

We hesitated to post this item, because our immediate reaction was speechlessness. The use of this quote was just so appallingly self-aggrandizing, tone-deaf, and condescending that we were stunned.

But others in the community have brought it up as well, so it has definitely struck a nerve with a number of people and merits comment here.

From Lisa Shaffer's October 4 newsletter:
THE MAN IN THE ARENA Excerpt from the speech “Citizenship In A Republic” delivered by Theodore Roosevelt on 23 April, 1910
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.
The description of a politician as a "strong man" and a "doer of deeds" is telling. Roosevelt's words would be more appropriate coming from Vladimir Putin than from a legislator in a representative democracy who understands that her job is to represent the interests of her constituents.

Teddy Roosevelt had his great strengths and accomplishments, but listening to others and building consensus were not among them. As the quote above might indicate, Roosevelt was a "my way or the highway" kind of guy. In fact, he turned against his former friends, splintered his political party, and then lost his third Presidential run in a landslide. Not that that has anything to do with anyone in Encinitas.

As for the doing of deeds, we eagerly await the new council doing something toward fulfilling its campaign promises, or, indeed, doing anything differently than the Stocks/Bond/Dalager council would have done.

122 comments:

  1. Arsenic and old lace. Don't drink the elderberry wine.

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  2. I think your commentary here proves the point. Lots of critics around here, few who are actually doing anything...

    Cold and timid souls indeed.

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    1. Right! Prop A was a piece of cake for the volunteers when Gus Vina used our own tax funds against volunteers, used staff against it, used city staff against it, got the council to go against it, got former political leaders like Stocks and Guerrin against it, and got close to $100,000 from various local and out of state funders to fight this initiative. It still one.

      The only possible conclusion is that those Prop A people were wrong and didn't do anything!!

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    2. It still won--not one!!

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    3. Don't forget that they hired Rutan and Tucker using $30,000 of our taxfunds since the law firm cautioned that if Prop A passes, it could lead to citizens having the ability to define their own community character! What a terrible thing that would be for Vina, developers, and the city bloodsuckers!

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  3. Holding elected officials accountable is what we are suppose to do after giving you our vote.

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  4. City council what have you accomplished so far?

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  5. What has council done so far:

    1. Reduced the buffers for the wetlands.
    2. Allowed rowdy bars.
    3. Lied on the council statement for Prop A
    4. Ignored residents concerns
    5. Kissed up to Vina

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    Replies
    1. Gotta laugh at this: the entire run up to Prop A was one big fat lie by North County Associates etc...

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    2. Who are they?

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    3. The bars were there before most of the current council, let's be fair.

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  6. WCV, I'm surprised you have anything good to say about Teddy. In reality he was eons to the left of the evil negro Kenyon dictator that rules our land now. By current libertarian standards Teddy was a flat out commie. He actually believed that corporations had a responsibility to society in exchange for their existence in our country! I suppose when someone wants to frack for oil next door to you that you will congratulate them for exercising their liberty. Quite frankly, libertarians are really the biggest leeches ever. You get to employ people who were publicly educated for your companies and roads that were paid for by the public, for your own profit, but you do not want to pay for any of it. WCV: please show me one historic example of your libertarian fantasy.Look, we agree on many things, particularly that public employees pay and benefits should be in line with the private sector, however I just think libertarians are just super selfish freaks.
    The Cabezon

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    1. You don't have to go full anarchist to be "libertarian."

      Most libertarians I know are quite reasonable and would settle for going back to just somewhat lower levels of government spending, along with much less government intrusion in our personal lives.

      Even rolling back spending to the % of GDP it was 10 or 20 years ago would be a huge step forward.

      Today there was a great column in USA Today by noted libertarian law professor Glenn Reynolds (of Instapundit fame). It compares the recurring success of freedom and entrepreneurialism with the recurring failure of big government. I agree wholeheartedly. Please read and let me know what parts you disagree with:

      link

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    2. This excerpt is what Pam Slater Price sends yearly to anyone who loses a run for office in North County. Surprised that Lisa published this after being cut loose from Slater Price in such an ugly way.

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    3. Ugly, or deserved? Lisa has turned an icy demeanor to even the most loyal followers who dare to contradict her, even in private.

      On top of that, she claimed one belief system, yet perpetrates another and has shown herself to be afraid to be the lone vote on pretty much everything. So much for ethics and character.

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    4. That sounds like Lisa taking a quote that Pam uses to encourage candidates for their courage in running, and turning it into a defense mechanism for herself. In this context, these words become a way to stab voters and other former supporters.

      Any person who runs for office deserves respect for entering the race, but voters also deserve respect. She is missing the point that it was she and the rest of the council that turned on us and turned on their own campaign promises.

      The people who put them in office are out of the picture now that they got our money and our votes. They now report to Gus Vina.

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    5. Allright, the Obama is a bad black person from Kenya birther conspiracy isn't dead (sarcasm).

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    6. Mr. L,

      What?

      Stick to the topic. Please don't compare Lisa to Obama now! Her comparison of herself to Roosevelt is bad enough, and I don't find your sarcasm very funny.

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    7. Hey, I needed a birth certificate I got it in less than 24 hours, you can too! So why did it take President Obama so long to produce 'a live certificate of birth'? Why didn't the press cover Sherriff Joe's and Harvard Grad Jerome Corsi's press conference (you can google this) why did the media mock Sherriff Joe rather than question what he found (you can also see this for yourself on the video) why did Eric Holder harass Sherriff Joe (hmm, kind of like the IRS harassing people with opposing views) Who is Frank Marshall Davis- if you don't know should you? Atleast so you can make up your own mind?

      Did President Obama attend Occidental, Columbia or Harvard as a foreign exchange student? Did the president get financial aid as a foreign exchange student? We don't know President Obama's first Executive Order as president was to seal his records (please google to verify this also is a fact) George Bush released his transcripts, Bill Clinton his, Hillary hers- is the President hiding something?

      The facts I speak are the truth. All should research to reach their own conclusions. All should be watchful for bullies and hate mongers who seek to intimidate, belittle, silence and obfuscate you and those you love from asking questions and seeking what you determine to be the truth.

      Don't let someone else decide for you, research, learn, ask questions and decide for yourself.

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    8. I did, he was born in Hawaii.

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/27/obama-birth-certificate-r_n_854248.html

      I'm ok with asking the question, but when you think you have found the answer, consider the source and then show the sources, as I have.

      He went to Occidental, Columbia and Harvard:

      http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/studentid.asp

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    9. I did, he was born in Hawaii.

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/27/obama-birth-certificate-r_n_854248.html

      I'm ok with asking the question, but when you think you have found the answer, consider the source and then show the sources, as I have.

      He went to Occidental, Columbia and Harvard:

      http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/studentid.asp

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    10. Mt. L

      The first act President Obama did was to sign an executive order sealing his records. Why? Did he go to those schools as a foreign exchange student? Did he get financial aid as a foreign exchange student? We know he got mediocre grades in HS so how did he get into Harvard? Why am I able to get my birth certificate in less than one day but the President can't? And when he does produce a document it is a 'certificate of live birth"

      I showed you all of my sources, it is you now trying to discredit me claiming I did not. The Huffington Post? It is a biased rag- the same as Fox (by the way Andrew Breitbart helped launch the Huffington Post and the Drudge report)

      My sources are these for my fellow readers- watch the sherrif joe press conference. Why did not major news outlet cover his press conference? Why was he ridiculed by reporters for seeking answers to simple questions? Why did Eric Holder's justice department harass Sherriff Joe?

      Snopes- really? That is the extent of your research?

      Fellow citizens watch Sherriff Joe's press conference. Ask yourself why it is you can get your birth certificate in less then a day and President Obama can't? Ask why no major news outlet covered or reported on the press conference? Ask why did President Obama seal his records as his first Executive Order?

      Sure Mr. Leucadia, I could tell you to go to the World Net Daily Site, or google 'birth certificate Joel press club" but I am not, heck that would be like telling people to go to snopes or the huffington post.

      People with an interest watch the sherriff Joe press conference and then make up your own mind. Who is Fran Marshall Davis?

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    11. You're going with the conspiracy mindset. If he did X, it means Y. The footage of Obama's certificate was on all the major news outlet, and the whole birther movement has even been rejected by those in the Republican party, like John MccAin. I could go 10-30 links deep on Obama's college history, but it's a waste of time. This is all a tit for tat conversation. The question is, why do you want to believe that he's not an American citizen? Is the possible answer because you A.) don't want him to be president because b.) he's a black man. I find the whole argument hilarious because Obama grew up in Hawaii with his white grandparents and went to the rich guy high school, Punaho. He didn't grow up in the ghetto etc. I get that it bothers some people, especially older white Americans who see it as a sign that "the others" are taking over. As someone who went to school with a lot of black, latino, Asian and other folks, it's a great thing. It teaches you to be more accepting. It doesn't hurt, honest. A lot of this started with Bush II, the constant conspiracy talk about his past, calls for impeachment. I was against it then, I'm against it now. One person wins, one loses and then we pull together. Times are bad, there's a lot of reasons, some that people don't want to admit. The bottom line is Obama has several more years in office, period. Better to hope for something good to happen than waste time with conspiracies. We have our own community here to worry about, that's where this thread started. Get involved, back a candidate, run yourself. It all starts locally....

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    12. Mr. Leucadian it is my opinion your comments are bullying and it is you who is narrow minded. I encourage others to think for themselves.

      Because an individual encourages other citizens to watch the youtube video tape of Sherriff Joe's press conference you label that person a racist, you then go on a diatribe about that person being white. It is my opinion you bully by name calling and seek to silence because you don't want people to watch the Sherriff Joe video and decide for themselves.

      I am white. I voted for President Obama. I sent President Obama money for his campaign (not much, the online website he had in 2008) You attempt to discredit me implying I am a republican, it is you who is biased.

      The media did not cover President Obama's background, ancestry or political ideologies. He was presented to me in 2008 by the media and his own speeches as a candidate seeking to unite the country to work together and as being opposed to raising the debt ceiling- these were all lies. More people have died under President Obama in Afghanistan then Bush- why doesn't the media report these numbers?

      President Obama believes in the ideology of critical race theory as taught by Professor Derrick Bell of Harvard, President Obama spent 20 years in the ideology of Black Liberation Theology which got it's root in the black power movement of the 60's. Both CRT and BLT are about one race being superior and powerful to others- That these are facts only means we should not ignore them. Do you would paint anyone who believes in equality and questions these ideologies as racist?

      When I watched the Sherriff Joe interview I began to ask myself why it is that I, my brother, my sister, my parents, you, my neighbors and all my friends can go get their birth certificate in less then 24 hours but President Obama could not? All he could produce was the suspect 'Certificate of live birth"?

      When I watched the Sherriff Joe youtube video I had to ask why the press did not ask a single question about the evidence Sherriff Joe produced? Was it a white wash?

      When I watched the Sherriff Video and I asked myself why were we not told any of this in 2008, there are too many questions and too few answers.

      In my opinion narrow minded partisan hacks attempt to paint any independent thinker who thinks for himself as a racist. .

      Everyone, watch the Sherriff Joe Video. Why was President Obama's first executive order to seal his records? Why does President Obama have a Connecticut social security number if he was born in HW? How do you explain the discrepancy on President Obama selective Service number?

      It was you who introduced this subject and topic, it is I who encourage others to simply watch the Press Conference of a Sherriff who has served the public honorably for decades and been re-elected time and time again to reach their own conclusions.

      I have gotten involved, I have backed a candidate, that candidate was Barack Obama.

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    13. As Col. Potter would say, horse puckey. Where is there a bullying statement in there? If you want to watch the video, watch it. It carries no weight with me. None of the birther stuff does. Why would I possibly assign credibility to a sherriff in Arizona, who clearly has issues with Obama (that's another topic) talking about whether Obama is a citizen. It's a distraction, and to me a low blow against the president of the country. When a lot of my more liberal friends came up with stuff about Bush and impeachment, I didn't go for that either.

      I misspoke earlier, a lot of the conspiracy stuff started with Clinton, that he was a commie agent etc. But it continued with Bush, picked up steam after 9/11 and is still pretty rampant right now.

      I ask you honestly, why does the birther stuff appeal to you? Isn't it enough to say you didn't get what you expected with Obama, if that's the case? Why does there have to be a conspiracy? I never said you were a Republican, but there's nothing wrong with that in my mind. I grew up a Republican, and the other 3 members of my family were/are old school Rockefeller/Reagan Republicans.

      Their really aren't substantial diffs. in the parties in the U.S., not like in the UK and Europe. That's what lead me to be an independent. I voted for Nader twice, and Gary Johnson the last time.

      I apologize if I offended, but let's be honest, there are a lot of older white folks not digging on Obama because he's black/different/ what have you. My point was, if you come from a varied background like I do, it just doesn't phase you, he's another candidate, another dude who rises and falls on his own merit.

      To me again, the birther stuff is a distraction. Sherrif Joe (again, diff topic) is under investigation for civil rights violations against Latinos for unlawful search and detainment. I don't think he, Holder and Obama will hug anytime soon. They don't get along, it's ok. Jan Brewer the governor and others in that state have disavowed Sherrif Joe's birther comments.

      Full disclosure, I backed Obama the first time, not the 2nd, but I judged him on his merits in the job, not on unsubstantiated rumors. I just find that stuff does us all a disservice from the real issues. And to be fair, that info was out there before the first election. I saw a lot of the birther stuff in 2008. It was dissected then, and a lot of the claims just can't be verified. A lot of the info is based on internet rumors, people like Alex Jones and the guy in LA who did the Obama video about the guy in Hawaii who's allegedly his father. You can see the tie in they would want there, the guy's a liberal lefty, supposedly a communist. It's just too easy, too dirty, and smacks of all the swiftboat stuff. Let's accuse a guy who served when we didn't. Silly. But people will buy it.

      Both parties need to get back to square one and do the nation's business, we need to figure out how the entitlements like SS and Medicare can be made sustainable. We need to add jobs, repair our infrastructure, figure out immigration (which every pres. back to Carter took a pass on). We don't have time for whether the president's Colubmia ID card looks wrong. The past is the past..

      It's a disillusioning time, to be sure. I lost my longtime job 3 years ago. But in another few years, we'll have a chance to vote again and change the tune.....

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    14. L-

      Yes, you implied questioning President Obama's legitimacy to be President made one a racist.- This of course is what the palace guards in the press and ideologues scream whenever anyone questions the President's failed economic, social or global policies. It is the tactics of name calling, attacking and bullying opponents taught by Saul Alinsky..

      Yes, you implied questioning President Obama's legitimacy must make one either a republican or a white man- also what the ideologues scream whenever someone questions the failed policies of the President.

      It is not a low blow to hold the press accountable for failing to vet then candidate Obama and his ideologies and his past. Critical Race Theory is racist, Black Liberation Theology is racist. Neither is an ideology based on equality, both are ideologies based on power. Because I am offended by racism and believe in equality for all I think the press should have shared this information, they did not.

      The legitimacy questions are relevant not only because of constitutional requirements to be President but also because it shows the character or lack there of, of a candidate running for office. I repeat the question- Why can I , my brother, my sister, my parents, you and my friends all get our birth certificates within 24 hours but the President couldn't? Why can we all get birth certificates but the President can only get a 'certificate of live birth"? Why does President Obama have a social security number from the State of Conn when he never lived there? Why is there a discrepancy in President Obama's selective service number? You have given me no answers but rather ridiculed my questioning of how this can be?

      As for Sherriff Joe I watched the video and he was a reasonable, informed, measured public leader. As for the Holder investigation of the Sherriff I note he has ben re-elected many times over by the people he serves as his experience is beyond reproach. He was recently re-elected and Holder has dropped the investigation. In Arizona if you are an illegal immigrant and have broken the law and you get penalized, in California you are given a free drivers license, free health care, food stamps and a free education. Under the affordable act all American citizens are all required to buy insurance while illegal immigrants are exempt. Last week WW II veterans were blocked under orders from President Obama to go to the war memorial whiloe a few days later the SEIU union that helped elect Candidate Obama and the racist group LA RAZA along with Nancy Pelosi held a rally at the same park for illegal immigration.


      I ask again fellow readers, as a person who supported candidate Obama, why was it that President Obama's first Executive Order as President was to seal his records?

      I hope more people will watch the youtube Sherriff Joe video and reach their own conclusions.

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    15. To summarize, the birther information was there before 2008, it was investigated and debunked, by yes, the mainstream media. We could have a long discussion about the mainstream media and what kind of job it's doing, but again, it's a separate topic. Many in the Republican party debunked it, Jan Brewer debunked it.

      Maybe you can tell me why only the Alex Jones of the world support that kind of witch hunt. The information just isn't there. It's all summarized, covered etc. right here.:

      http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/jun/27/obamas-birth-certificate-part-ii/

      My overall take is, a conspiracy requires people to conspire, and then keep it a secret, something most are really bad at...That's what it would have taken to pull off the birth certificate fraud.

      I'm sorry you weren't happy with your choice of pres, that is certainly your right. But judging by his actions, I just don't by any of the black liberation stuff. I don't see it in his policies.

      If anything, Obama has been pretty conservative, much to the disappointment of my liberal friends.

      As for Sherriff Joe, he has his backers, and his opponents, like most elected officials. I'm not a fan, I think that's clear. But more than that, he's in a different state, and doesn't have a big effect on my life. I just don't see the relevancy. If he runs for president, I'll see the relevance.

      As for how fast Obama did or didn't get his cert, let's ask EVERYONE who runs for every office from now on. Let's see how everyone reacts to being accused of being a foreigner, a muslim, a spy and ad nauseum. I dissagree with all the witchhunts, starting with Clinton, and continuing through Bush and now with Obama. To me, it's a poison to our society, carried through the internet and filtered through a lack of critical thinking skills.

      I personally am a Cal. native, and I'm staying, warts and all and try to make it a better place. I just can't get behind the anti-immigrant stance, which isn't to say we don't need reform.

      I wish you good luck in your endeavors.....





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    16. My comments have been fact based.

      I encourage people to watch the Sherriff Joe's press conference and reach their own conclusion. The media you claim vetted this issue did not. The media portrayed rational people asking questions as a racist or an old white person - similar to your comments. The media did not report the press conference, many American's have never seen it. The media did not ask why President Obama has a Conn Social Security number when he did not live there? The main stream media did not ask why President Obama has a discrepancy with his selective service number? The main stream media did not ask why the President's first executive Order was to seal his records?

      As for Critical Race theory, I encourage you to research the racists teachings of Derrick Bell the Harvard professor. CRT puts forth the premise that only by gaining control of the courts can color be brought to gain power over those of another color. CRT means the law can be controlled to promote policies and ideologies that support one race over another. 2 examples- In Philadelphia the New Black Panthers were videotaped in front of polling stations with billy clubs intimidating voters. You may endorse this type of intimidation I don't. You can google the video clip. I believe any racial entity that puts one race before another, be it the KKK or the NBPP should be barred from intimidating voters, do you?. The Bush administration filed charges against the New Black Panther Party but Eric Holder dropped the charges. Example 2 is the incident our country just experienced where WWII vets were denied access to national monuments, yet LA RAZA (The Race) and SEIU not only were given access to those same monuments but public servants paid by taxpayers were employed to pick up after the mess illegal immigrants made. That you choose to ignore this doesn't mean we should. Taxpayers who pay for the monuments were turned away but illegal immigrants were rewarded. We should ask why the Democratic National Party, the Associated Press, USA Today and the NY Times why they have stopped calling law breaking illegal immigrants illegal and are now calling them 'undocumented citizens' or 'undocumented immigrants'. Are we being lied to, manipulated? We should ask why Nancy Pelosi will actively work against the best interests of WWII veterans who pay taxes and then turn around and actively work to promote illegal immigrant law breakers? The bigger examples are within President Obama's economic, social and global policies.

      You are entitled to your opinion. You are not entitled to label those who ask legitimate questions as racists, republican or old white people because you don't like their questions.

      Because you can't answer the questions you attempt to discredit the question suggesting future candidates run and get their birth certificates I say yes, let's make it a requirement, wait, it already is! I got mine, and I'm sure you got yours and I bet neither says 'certificate of live birth'.

      I am all for legal immigration while it seems you paint people standing up for their rights as "Anti" -it is a negative meant to bias and intimidate. In truth they are pro rule of law while it seems you are for breaking the law.

      I am all for critical thinking. I encourage all to watch Sherriff Joe's Press conference and reach your own conclusions.

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    17. http://www.factcheck.org/2012/07/obamas-sealed-records/

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    18. 13489 Is the executive order president Obama signed dealing with sealing and releasing his records.

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    19. http://blogcritics.org/the-executive-order-13489-fallacy/

      http://www.fas.org/sgp/obama/presidential.html

      http://www.thefogbow.com/birther-claims-debunked1/other-stuff/

      http://badfiction.typepad.com/badfiction/the-executive-order-13489-myth.html

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    20. 8:47 thank you for linking the opinions of those who support President Obama and their interpretation of the Executive Order President Obama signed sealing Presidental records. Another person could easily post the opinions of others who disagree with the opinions you post.

      Thankfully we can all reach our own opinions on this subject by researching the following:

      1. Please google President Obama First Executive Order 13489 and read the executive order, don't rely on the opinions of others.

      2. Please watch the Sherriff Joe press conference presenting the evidence of an investigation and reach your own conclusions, do not rely upon the opinion of others.

      3. Ask yourself why you, your family, your friends can get a birth certificate in less than 24 hours but President Obama could not?

      3. Please ask yourself why President Obama has a social security number from Conn a state where he never lived?

      4. Please ask why President Obama has a discrepancy with his selective service number?

      5. Please ask why if you have never heard of his questionable social security number or selective service discrepancy you are hearing about it now for the first time ?

      6. Please ask why President Obama has refused to release his academic records that would prove he did not attend as a foreign exchange student?

      I am not asking you to believe the reporting of CNN , MSNBC or FOX. I am not asking you to believe the opinions of others listed above. I am simply asking you read the executive order and watch the Sheriff Joe press conference.................that way your opinion will be your own, not someone else's.

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    21. Please ask yourself why you can't accept the fact you didn't like who you voted for, and are trying to blame everyone but yourself. I voted for Obama the first time, and not the 2nd, but I Moved on. I watched the Sherriff Joe video, I don't find it verifiable or compelling. I read the Exec order, I clearly didn't draw the conclusion you did, although clearly we're both bringing assumptions in when we read it. Even given that, I didn't see anything diff. in his order than prior orders by other presidents.

      You clearly didn't come up with the bulleted list above by yourself, so doesn't that render your whole argument moot about sourcing the answers?. Why should I believe the word of someone who clearly doesn't like Obama, like sherriff joe, who def. has an axe to grind, over fact based publications that source their work like Politifact, Snopes and factcheck.org? These aren't opinions, that little number is a footnote, you can check the source. It's called journalism, which despite being in a weakened state, still exists.

      Questions are asked, research is done, and conclusions are drawn. You have a source, I have a source, so we have to agree to disagree.

      http://wiki.birtherdebunkers.net/index.php?title=President_Obama%27s_Selective_Service_Registration#The_Origin_of_the_Rumor

      http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/ssn.asp

      We could ask these questions about any president, but Obama is the easiest because he has a foreign sounding name, he spent time out of the country, went to multiple colleges and worked with and around some former 60's radical. Funny, because some noted right wing pundits like Michael Savage were also 60's radicals. It's ok, people change, times move on.

      The demographics in our society are changing, but if you believe like I do that diversity is strength, that's a good thing....

      Either way, Obama will not be leaving office until his term is up, no matter which one of us thinks he/she is right.

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    22. The poster does not blame anyone, why do you imply they do? Is it in hopes others don't watch the video and think for themselves?

      Isn't it arrogant of you to claim the person did not come up with that list themselves? Please provide us the link where you have seen this exact identical list? Otherwise we can only conclude you are throwing mud in hopes of covering something up and your credibility is toast.

      Sherriff Joe was mandated by law to investigate at the request the citizens who voted him into office, he was doing his job. It is only after he began investigating that the Holder Justice department began it's campaign of harassment. Maybe you oppose people doing the job they are elected to do, I don't.

      No one made a claim diversity was not a good thing and the poster made no comment on race- but you do, again. You bring this up in an attempt to imply those with opposing views to the President are racists or as you suggested before maybe republicans or old white people. I voted for President Obama because I thought he was the best person for the job. If a person voted for President Obama because of skin color wouldn't that make them the racist? I believe in equality for all not preferences based on skin color for a few. It looks like rather than ask others to watch the press conference you are using the tired flawed argument that those with opposing views must be racist.

      There is no mention in the post about the President having a different sounding name- you bring it up, why? In an effort paint those with opposing views as intolerant, simple minded or again- racist.

      Let's be frank, you have not once asked or suggested people watch the press conference video or read the executive order for themselves and reach their own conclusions, I have.

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    23. Just curious as to your take on the links provided, that's all.

      As I explained, I don't find the Sherriff Joe video credible or verifiable. It's a free country, if people want to watch it they can, and draw their own conclusions. Wouldn't it be counterintuative for me to suggest people watch something I place no credence in?

      See, we actually agree on something, I too voted for Obama the first time because I thought he was the best person for the job, that was several posts ago. I didn't vote for him last time because my opinion on his performance changed. Perhaps your opinion changed as well. My question still remains to you why you find
      #'s 1-6 above credible.

      My initial response that started this thread was because the poster at 5:14 stated " In reality he was eons to the left of the evil negro Kenyon dictator that rules our land now".

      This A.) Calls out Obama's race, B.) brings in the idea that he's not a native born American and C.) calls him a non-democratically elected president or that there was rigging of the ballot process (potentially implied). I still find that last part hilarious in light of the election of 2000. If you want the flipside there, the 1960 Kennedy-nixon election had some serious funny business in WVA and Illinois.


      As for our voting laws, I think they should be uniform in every state. Otherwise you run into issues like in North Carolina, where the Republican legislators passed a voter ID law.

      http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2013/09/30/4354548/eric-holder-announces-suit-against.html#.Ulht9Uq89I4

      I don't think there's any doubt that the Republicans know they are at registration/demographic advantage in the coming years. The electorate is getting younger, browner and right now more Democratic. The youth and minority vote put Obama over in the last 2 elections, of that there is no question. So race is a factor, you can't ignore it. My argument is more one about tactics and demographics, but if someone brings up a phrase like "Negro Kenyan dicator", I'm going to call them on it every time. You can't see all the Obama conspiracy stuff about communist links, Kenyans and on and on without assuming there's some kind of racial bias there by at least SOME of the people who are talking/agreeing with that line of reasoning. I mean, I've been around friends of mine, and they've basically said as much. Granted, I've heard the same things about Clinton.

      But what I'm saying is, that element is in there with the conspiracy stuff. You may not believe it, but I guarantee you a lot of people in the birther movement do....

      Delete
  7. Lisa did a disservice to everyone by quoting only a portion of the speech.
    She should have quoted this:

    Today I shall speak to you on the subject of individual citizenship, the one subject of vital importance to you, my hearers, and to me and my countrymen, because you and we a great citizens of great democratic republics. A democratic republic such as ours - an effort to realize its full sense government by, of, and for the people - represents the most gigantic of all possible social experiments, the one fraught with great responsibilities alike for good and evil. The success or republics like yours and like ours means the glory, and our failure of despair, of mankind; and for you and for us the question of the quality of the individual citizen is supreme. Under other forms of government, under the rule of one man or very few men, the quality of the leaders is all-important. If, under such governments, the quality of the rulers is high enough, then the nations for generations lead a brilliant career, and add substantially to the sum of world achievement, no matter how low the quality of average citizen; because the average citizen is an almost negligible quantity in working out the final results of that type of national greatness. But with you and us the case is different. With you here, and with us in my own home, in the long run, success or failure will be conditioned upon the way in which the average man, the average women, does his or her duty, first in the ordinary, every-day affairs of life, and next in those great occasional cries which call for heroic virtues. The average citizen must be a good citizen if our republics are to succeed. The stream will not permanently rise higher than the main source; and the main source of national power and national greatness is found in the average citizenship of the nation. Therefore it behooves us to do our best to see that the standard of the average citizen is kept high; and the average cannot be kept high unless the standard of the leaders is very much higher.

    ReplyDelete
  8. If ever there was a failed experiment in democracy it is encinitas.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. We thought we were buying one thing with our votes, got home after the election and found our purchase had been swapped out for something indistinguishable from the last council.

      How do we ensure better and truer representation next time?

      Delete
    2. Move to Carlsbad. Not much "bad" going on there.

      Delete
    3. Huh? Follow Norby?? Not on your life!

      Delete
    4. Keep voting, participation doesn't start and end with one election. One council with one term won't solve all your problems. It took 20 years to get where we're at, and it may take 20 to get out...

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  9. "...self-aggrandizing, tone-deaf, and condescending...." Spend five minutes in Lisa's company and you'll empathize with that characterization.

    Disappointment doesn't begin to describe her.

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    Replies
    1. She makes up facts. Several people have caught her in out right lies.

      What a great person to teach ethics!

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  10. Dismissive and condescending.

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    Replies
    1. Lisa is a narcissist and that says it all. She could care less about Encinitas and the only reason Maggie endorsed her is because Lisa met Maggie at Morse Cancer center when Lisa's husband was undergoing treatment the same time Maggie was. When Maggie endorsed her on the video she was on heavy duty pain meds and I wonder if she even knew who she really was.

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    2. Word is not really....

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    3. Low blow, she knew who Lisa was and what she stood for. Drugs had nothing to do with it.

      Delete
    4. Hmmm on your first sentence.

      Delete
    5. Cheap shot, unfair statement? Implying that Maggie only supported Lisa because she was heavily medicated is contrary to everything I've heard. That kind of hearsay lessens the discussion and the weight of any of that persons comments.

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  11. Teddy Roosevelt was a remarkable man in many ways. Sure he had his flaws, but he was a trust buster. He broke up monopolies, and yes, stood up to corporations and special interests.

    I feel anyone who is active is "in the arena." All of us, including the "little guy" are great men and women, making a difference.

    Lisa's newsletters are informative. My take, her defensiveness insulates her against any criticism, whether it is constructive, or not. She doesn't want to imagine or admit that she could be wrong. She did show some courage by being the only one to vote against the Sand Replenishment program with the Army Corpos of Engineers, which is unlikely to proceed due to the fact that the Army Corps has questions about cost/effectiveness with a reduced project scale, and the Coastal Commission will likely still continue to express firm reservations. Shaffer was the only no vote.

    However, she is seeing herself and her colleagues, now, as undeserving targets of criticism, including the openly expressed disappointment of those of us who voted for her and Tony Kranz.

    My point about Teddy Roosevelt's words is that Lisa, in her state of defensiveness, misapplied them to herself, as a leader, with her face "marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds . . ." That quote applies to all of Council's critics, too, all of us who are actively working for positive change, to inform the public, so we can elect people who will represent the interests of the public, all of the citizens of Encinitas, not catering to special interests and "connected" insiders.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Like him or not. Without Mr. Roosevelt there would be no Teddy Bear.

      Delete
  12. Good points, Lynn; interesting how Lisa sees herself as the embattled one. She's also made it crystal clear that she thinks she knows better than anyone else how to solve our problems.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Funny how Lynn talks and writes to herself... Geeze.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Actually...not. But if it makes you feel better, go for it.

      Delete
  14. Lisa "push" Maggie for her endorsement while she was on her death bed - that is pathetic! She barely knew her. Is that ethical, compassionate or just self-serving?

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  15. I can't wait for the KLCC to put up there next election. They will get many 5 to 10 votes and under best circumstance will get a few others to vote for their candidate out of ignorance. Many 20 votes at best. They are a total joke and a waste of tax payers money.

    KLCC is bad for Encinitas and the safety of our children.

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  16. Just like we won prop A

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    1. The five people on KLCC didn't win Shit....

      They always try and build themselves up and take credit for prop A. NOT. They are only 5 people with no other lives than gad flies that waste tax payers money with no solutions on false accusations.

      They are nothing more than a fly on a rats ass.

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    3. Prop A was WON, it passed, because of EVERYONE who voted YES. The campaign to support it was grassroots, begun by a few core members; petitions were circulated by many volunteers.

      The campaign against Prop A was well funded and well organized, and included our entire Council, voting against the best interests of the public.

      There is no such thing as KLCC, except in a delusional sociopath's mind. He made it up so he can have a target for his paranoia. Rage on, lol. You are projecting your own defecation obsession, Mr. Crappy Pants.

      Delete
  17. WCV, I read the link you provided. I'm glad you are not an Ayne Rand freak job. I have no beef with moderate libertarians ,including your last pres. candidate. Much of government at all levels is by nature incompetent because there is no accountabilty and no competition, however there are other factions (Koch bros,Manchester,hard right Christians) that back candidates and policies designed to make government and public education fail for their own selfish reasons. Sorry for being a little harsh and keep up the good work.
    The Cabezon

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  18. Cabezon-

    When people are given the option of going to public charter schools that run by different metrics they take it, why, because common core sucks, it has produced a generation of unprepared incompetent know-nothings- this is a fact, look at Oakland, Chicago or elsewhere

    Interesting how you leave Public employee Unions, George Soros, Media Matters, Hollywood and the music industry from your list- are they not complicit as well? Anthony Rezko- anyone? anyone? Buehller

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    1. First of all I believe that public employee unions should not be able to contribute a dime for the election of anyone who can directly effect their wages and benefits.Media Matters just posts the videos of people saying what they say. I was educated in the California school system and got an excellent education. Christian groups have been systematically trying to undermine that system for decades because they want the money for private schools. It's difficult to return to what was the best system in the world when a major party is beholden to these people. Republicans want it to fail. Your world appears to be black and white with the dividing lines defined by Rush,Sean,and Fox. I have as much in common educated libertarians/conservatives as I do with the evil liberals. The only way things will improve for all is to reform campain funding laws. I don't know a single right winger who is for that. They seem to prefer systematic bribery since most of the money goes their way.
      The Cabezon

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    2. Cabezon-

      You rush to paint as villains 'Christian schools' in an effort to make your point- 9:55 says nothing of Christian schools- why do you?

      If you feel there is no place for public SEIU unions, or the big democratic money from George Soros, Jay-Z or Hollywood, or money from teacher's unions they why did you not write that- instead you attempted to vilify only the Koch brothers.

      What was the best education system in the world is no more because of failed policy and leadership at the national and state level coupled with the disintegration of the American family- Common Core? today there is more emphasis on teaching that so called 8 year old transgendered Johnny can use 8 year old Sally's bathroom more then learning reading, writing and 'rithmatic'- have you contributed to this decline by the way you have voted- if so, own it, it is your fault, who have you voted for the past 30 years?

      Republicans want to fail? Truly, get your head out of wherever you are sticking it and form your own opinions. Your blanket statement is as ignorant as the person who claims all democrats want to fail.

      Did you know the house along with 22 democrats has voted to fully fund the WIC women, infant and children food assistance program and the senate and white house have refused? Do you support taking the food out of the mouths of the less fortunate, the house doesn't. However if you get your facts on state run propaganda media then you might have missed the truth I reference above. It is a simple question to you, should the senate pass the bipartisan house approved bill to fully fund WIC today, this moment- yes or no? I

      The black and white are the lines you have drawn. 9:55 makes no reference to political party and no reference to religion- it is you who does, clearly in an attempt to regurgitate the opinions of others to make yourself feel better about the facts of which you seem to know little about. Classic bullying, intimidating and dare I say intolerance.

      Yes, those dirty 'right wingers' as you call them, they are at fault. Just don't talk about the money, greed and power of Soros, Public SEIU Unions and their crony greedy relationships with Chicago and the current and past administrations-

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    3. In todays political debate opposing viewpoints are always given defacto equivalency when that is rarely the case. Decades of empirical data on the success of vaccines greatly outweigh any claims made by deniers of their veracity. There is no credible link between vaccines and autism. Another false equivalency is between science and religion. There need not be any contradictions between the two, yet there is a massive push to replace science with religion in schools. I could care less about one's political affiliation, but I care deeply about kids being taught the difference between science and religion, about false equivalencies, about breaking away from the shackles of dogma and thinking for themselves. No political affiliation has a claim on that.

      - The Sculpin

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    4. Yes, logic and philosophy can begin to be taught at an early age, including ethics, and the difference between integrity and "situational ethics."

      False equivalencies are another form of false logic. False analogies are used to "market" to the vulnerable or biased and/or ignorant/uneducated "consumers of information," often hungry with greed, motivated by fear, ready to swallow the bait, grabbing for twisted, spinning lures of "untruth, shiny PR jive, "hook, line and sinker.

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    5. They wish the citizens would dumb down and let all this hooey slip by. Like believing affordable housing lies than are just ruse for up zoning to support pensions.

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    6. Sculpin, stick to what you know. Yes, vaccines are beneficial. Yes, there is a vaccine-autism link. Don't link vaccine deniers with those who have been harmed by vaccines and want better for our children. Read a vaccine package insert. Understand what encephalitis means. Then understand that autism is not a medical diagnosis but a diagnosis based on behaviors.

      And then consider yourself lucky that you haven't felt compelled to question the veracity of the "science" because of first hand experience.

      Delete
    7. Amen, Sculpin. And on schools, isn't the question whether we as a society are going to back our public schools? A lot of us are the products of good public schools. Do we want to make education for profit, as a lot of the charter schools are? I am a firm believer that we need good public schools. If you want your own private school, fund it yourself, without public money.

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    8. Pasadena is now teaching all public school children how to accept that an elementary school child seeking attention and confused about his sexuality wants to go into little sally's bathroom and wear a dress, and the kids should learn from this and accept this- The important stuff like reading, writing, math, science are no longer emphasized. Public schools are a joke, teachers unions buy politicians who reward them. I dare say that Sculpin and Mr L are the ones who voted for failed policies and failed leaders that have set in place policies and ideologies of learning that have led to our schools going from the best in the world to the middle of the pack. Will Scuplin and L accept responsibility for their role in the deterioration of American public schools? Who did they vote for?

      By the way- Christian Schools, Catholic Schools, Private schools don't take government money and don't want government money. They turn out great students, far superior to public school kids.

      That is why now Governor Brown when he was Mayor of Oakland helped to fund a 'Charter School' that did take government money. Like Private schools the charter schools made kids wear uniforms and have a code of responsibility and conduct for performance and behavior. If they failed the kids got booted. Parents were lined up around the corner to get their kids out of public schools and into the charter schools. You can google this fact and read it for yourself.

      Delete
    9. Public schools are not joke. They are full of dedicated young people who want to make a differnce. What is a joke is the ongoing battle on the curriculm. You seem to be pretty focused on theis gender issue. Frankly, I don't care. It's fine if the school wants to lend that child a hand in sorting out their issues. I'm sure I have voted for failed policies and leaders, as have you, but I have also voted for successful ones! That's what happens in a democracy! As for private or religious schools turning out better students than public, I'm not sure I agree. I have kids that went to both, and I'm not sure that any one of them is better equipped or better educated than the others. After all, an education is only as good as what you do with it.

      - The Sculpin

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    10. Sorry, 11:12 - the link is just not there...........and the word science does not need quotes.....

      - The Sculpin

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    11. "the word science does not need quotes....."

      It does when you don't want to waste time writing "science fiction".

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    12. 8:37, I think that was Arcadia that had the transgender issue

      http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/general-news/20130724/arcadia-district-reaches-settlement-in-transgender-rights-case

      Stuff like that just distracts from the real issues of education. There are more important things to worry about. Truth be told, I went to Pasadena schools, quite a long time ago and got a good education. Now their schools are struggling. Because people with any kind of $ bailed on the schools and send their kids to Pasadena Poly, Maranatha, St. Francis etc...Pasadena was the first peacefully integrated school district in the nation and leader in tolerance. I learned everything I know about accepting different people of all races, religion etc from my time in those schools.Hopefully they will make a comeback. If they have to change the curriculum, so be it. We have to have people with skills that fit today's world....
      ...

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    14. Hi L I agree that 'stuff like that distracts from the real issue of education' however, it is exactly this 'stuff' the dome ideologies and leaders focus on instead of educating our kids in reading, writing, math and science. It is focus on this 'stuff' and accompanying ideologies that have helped our public schools essentially go from first to worst-

      How do you think little Sally is going to focus on learning sitting next to cross dressing Johnny while Sally is being 'instructed' by public educators to be 'tolerant' rather than simply learning to add 2+2?

      These are the facts. We have become a society based on what we allow and who we elect.

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    15. The link is not there, as you say, because the IOM believes we would weaken the current vaccination program by even looking. True science would continue to search. And some true science is still going on, but not at the levels that the autism crisis deserves. And what the latest science reveals is that there is an immune system component to autism. UC Davis is a leader in this area.

      Agreed that science, true science, does not need quotes. Your use of the word, and the argument that says "science" has spoken and there is no link, needs them, and more.

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    16. Brought to you by World Net Daily

      Delete
    17. No, brought to you by somebody who actually reads the studies used as "proof" that "science" has spoken. Somebody who understands much more on the subject than would care to because of personal, life-changing, experiences. Somebody who knows a large group of people, educated people, in your community, with similar experiences. Somebody who believes vaccines provide a benefit to most, but in a subset of the population contributes to an incredible harm. Somebody who thinks we can do better, just as we have improved previous vaccines when proven to cause damage in the past.

      Delete
    18. 1:22. I can't agree that it's a distraction. There are deeper issues at work. In the 70's, California had the best schools in the nation, now we don't. Various factors like Prop 13, defunding of schools, abandonment of public schools, ESL learners and the curriculum could be proposed as possible contributors. Cross-dressing, probably not. When I went to HS in Pasadena, we had punk rockers, hippies, mods, cholos, Crips, preppies. None of that distracted from learning, you either went to class and learned or got stones behind the handball courts. We need to be a society that needs to figure out what we are doing wrong in the schools, period. I went to a religious school, it was not as good as a public school at the time. The teachers weren't as good, period. That was then, this is now. Some people have gender issues, it's not new. Let's accept it and move on....

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    19. FYI, for the debate, background on debunking of the post 1998 link between vaccines and autism..

      http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/europe/jan-june10/lancet_0204.html

      http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/02/08/did-the-media-inflame-the-vaccine-autism-link/?_r=0

      http://www.forbes.com/sites/emilywillingham/2013/08/09/court-rulings-dont-confirm-autism-vaccine-link/

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3136032/

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    20. If you're going to research, then also consider these:

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18769550

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20048084

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23984403

      But this argument is about more than just one vaccine. It should be about the apparent mystery of regressive asd and the lack of scientific curiousity to fully engage and study the cause. If your child regresses and develops asd, you would think the scientific community would want to investigate and study your child. Akin to pediatric cancer centers where best-in-care practices are coordinated across the country (see Children's Oncology Group). But, no, not with autism. And its a national disgrace.

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    21. May I ask if a member of your family or circle has autism? A close neighbor's son has it, and I see the effect every day. I am very sympathetic and rooting for a cure every day. I provided the links above mainly as a discussion point, since many have cited the Wakefield study as evidence of causation until it was discredited. I agree it's a national disgrace that there isn't more being done and that the national dialogue hasn't been more robust. However, I do think we still need vaccines, as the outbreak of Whooping cough last year showed.

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    22. Yes. And i appreciate the sympathetic post. Agree with you that most vaccines are beneficial (got my preservative-free flu shot today at work as a matter of fact). But to group autism families with vaccine deniers as Sculpin did, which is not uncommon btw, deserves a challenge.

      Now, back to discussing public schools...

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    23. meant to say "beneficial to most" not "most vaccines"..

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    24. Unfortunately, there are vaccine deniers out there. But on schools, we're lucky to have good ones locally in Encinitas. It's clearly a choice for people to send their kids to private schools, but not everyone can, and we need people coming out of the public schools to be as prepared for the kind of jobs that will be created. Right now a lot of schools aren't doing the job, and that hurts all of us...

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    25. 5:38 - challenge appreciated! My daughter is involved in the autism community so I understand their issues well and I know there are many viewpoints - some real, and some, well, let's just leave it at that.

      - The Sculpin

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    26. There you go again, Sculpin. "let's just leave it at that", nudge-nudge. Nevermind those crazy wacko autism parents and their conspiracy theories.

      You know so much. You don't know jack. My daughter is involved blah blah. Its a booming business for sure, becoming an aide or therapist. Its pathetic.

      Don't you realize most autism parents took their children in for their vaccinations. Observed regression following said vaccinations (and other viral exposures for sure). And then had little to no support from the traditional medical community afterwards.

      There is very little honest dialogue about it all. And one of the tactics is to associate educated concerned parents with the fringe.

      Your smug attitude towards it is all too typical.

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    27. 11:44 - can we at least agree that the sun comes up in the morning! I'm sure there are a few autism parents that you know (and your heart cries out for them) that have some pretty whacky thoughts. Be honest. And the autism community is no different than the cancer community, the vegan community, or the roundabout community! It all goes back to equivalency - not all opposing theories, not all opposing ideas carry the same weight and too many refuse to acknowledge that. Sorry for being too typically smug.

      - The Sculpin

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    28. 11:44 that is very interesting point. I don't know much about this. I did question why so many kids are diagnosed with Asperbergers and put on drugs. Then I learned that every kids diagnosed with asperbergeras per Berger means more money for the schools. I would like to know more of your thoughts

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    29. Oh jeeze 7:27 - you have enough information to come up with your own thoughts. How about this - do a little research, form an opinion, and then come back here and ask 11:44 what they think of your opinion. That way, you could have an informed discussion about the issue.

      - the sculpin

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    30. scuplin- sounds like 7:27 touched a nerve with you, hmm. It is an interesting point, are more more kids diagnosed by the state school system with Aspergbergers leading to more kids on drugs (good for pharma) and more tax money for the schools (hmmm) sounds like the person did do good research and is informed. You apparently just don't like the information or the opinion.

      On a different note but related to the pharmaceutical industry the recent mass murders that like Lockner person in Arizona, the nut job batman person in Colorado and the Conn psycho, all three were on drugs, what drugs were they on and why? I don't recall the media providing any coverage of weather they may or may not have been on the same drugs - maybe I missed it, there was a lot of talk about guns but not about why all three of them had a scary demented look in their eyes and all three were on drugs.

      I don't imagine they have much problem with misdiagnosing kids and over prescribing medication in the elite schools systems of say Manhattan , but it might well be a problem in the less affluent schools systems.

      Interesting you did not contribute to the subject scuplin and rather attacked the comment -hmmm, do you own stock in any pharma companies?

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    31. no, 7:27 is not right in their inference that there is a coordinated effort to get more kids diagnosed so that schools will get more pay. its an incredible insult.

      aspergers is not the autism that was being discussed above btw.

      your point about ssri use and mass murders is a very interesting one. i would hope that there is some serious investigation into this but that investigation is not apparent yet.

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    32. 9:38 you are certainly entitled to your opinion and feeling the 7:27 comment is an insult.

      However, there is no denying public school officials -doctors on contract, counselors etc- diagnosing kids with Aspi results in schools getting more money. It is an interesting potential conflict of interest to be aware of and a point worthy of consideration and at minimum exploration of alternatives.

      In my day we had hyper kids, fidgety kids, vocal kids, needy kids, quiet kids, unfocused kids.................heck, that sounds like just about all kids! We didn't have 'Aspi's' and not many kids were on drugs, exercise, out door activity, art, play, drawing seemed to be a big help to stimulate proper left/right brain growth. Of course drugs, big pharma and funding for schools were not the big issues then as they are today.

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    33. Oh you people just drive me nuts!!!! Yes, it hit a nerve. Just because two events may be related doesn't mean they are. And then to go "hmmmmmm", basically inferring that there must be something sinsister and that it occured between parties with malice forethought.
      Aaaaaahhhrrrgggggggg~~~~~~~~

      So how about this - I have always suspected that the increase in celiac and other intestinal diseases may have something to do with the genetic manipulation of the wheat/rice/corn seed stock. Yes, gluten-free is now a fad (a particularly stoopid one - just like alkaline water) but hidden within its popularity is an increase in genuine cases. Is it possible that by manipulating the seed stock we have made wheat/rice/corn toxic to an increasing number of humans? There are a few researchers looking into this. One of the problems is that there is very little, if any of the original seed stock left to base a control from. It's an interesting hypothesis! All that said, I see absolutely no evidence of big agriculture and big pharma conspiring to develop a seed stock that produces more profits through sales, and more profit for pharma for celiac and other similar drugs! And that is precisely what some on the lunatic fringe do......that drives me nuts!!!!

      - The Sculpin

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    34. 10:08am, public school officials diagnose kids? who, where? not in EUSD or Cardiff. they may make recommendations to parents to check things out. but not on a whim and definitely not as a profit center.

      things are not as they were 'in your day'. and not enough people are asking the hard questions as to why.

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    35. WC, that is quite a video link. I suppose some might refer to the producers as conspiracy theorist. It seems the hard question to ask might be should we question the government?

      In other news the Los Angeles Unified School district today announced all workers will be wearing 'Rainbow badges" for national coming out day and to promote homosexual relations. It seems to me the schools are focused on sexuality and gender in our schools? So much for reading, writing and science when we can all learn to discuss and accept the sexual identity confusion of 8 year old Johnny in Pasadena/Glendale who wants to wear a dress and use little sally's bathroom. Jeez, I wonder if LAUSD has a heterosexual day and badge to celebrate the family unit? Should we be surprised Johnny wants to be Sally? I suppose asking these questions one risks being labeled homophobic or intolerant by the bullies, even when they are not.

      In NYC this week it was reported some 70,000 parents marched across the Brooklyn Bridge to demand more charter schools for their kids- guess the PS NYC system is failing inner cities, likely not in Manhattan thought.

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    36. You really can't shake this Johnny issue, can you? By the way, every day is heterosexual day - hadn't you noticed?

      - The Sculpin

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    37. I dunno W.C. - not really. I think it completely misses the point. I do know one thing for certain - the more a parent (or 2) are involved in their childs education, the better they do. Period. In the first 30 seconds of the video, Maya's mom relinquishes her resposibility to her child - so the system is to blame?!?! Naw........too simple. In a way, that video does more to contribute to the dumbing down than anything else.....

      - The Sculpin

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    38. Scuplin- it seems to me the LAUSD focused on gender and sexuality. You never answered the question, does LAUSD have a 'Heterosexual Day" and a badge? -it is a simply yes or no question.

      Interesting you have no comment on the 70,000 NYC parents demanding charters schools for their kids, what with your opinion public schools are doing a terrific job.

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    39. Do you have any answer's to question - should LAUSD have a heterosexual day with a badge to celebrate heterosexual marriages and relationships?

      Also, what do you think about parents who want kids to focus on teaching their kids their own values or talking about sex rather then having the school, state and government decide when to have that talk, how to have that talk and how to explain it is ok for Johnny in a dress to use little Sally's bathroom?

      I don't ask to be confrontational. You write above that Maya's mom in the video gave up the teaching to the state, yet you also endorse the schools, state and government teaching supposed so called social values over the priority of teaching writing, reading and math. You seem to be proving the point the video makes.

      LAUSD is having a 'Coming Out" day. Is it the role of the school to promote the homosexual lifestyle, and explain the homosexual lifestyle, or is it the role of the government schools to teach reading, math and science? Is it possible the schools are only confusing children more at an early age about sexuality? It seems to make the video's point that schools might be social experiments to promote ideologies in line with the government, not the individual families, values and freedom or thought.

      I am glad you think California public schools are great but the facts don't support you. California ranks 42nd in Education out of all the states, bottom dwellers. Despite raising our income, sales and property taxes the state ranks 49th in spending per student - but hey, glad we still have some money for the LAUSD to buy Rainbow badges, maybe they had a Pacific View like school donated to all members of the community that their Superintendent sold to developers keep the schools afloat.

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    40. You are clearly lacking in debating skills. You also seem to take me more seriously than I do.....Tell me, do you still beat your wife? It's a simple yes or no answer, so just answer it........

      - The Sculpin

      - The Sculpin

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    41. Scupdude- there are facts on the table. You claim California Public Schools are in good shape, the poster puts up facts that California is 42 worst in the bottom. Rather than rebut the statement the best you do is to question debate skills. You then ask if the poster beats their spouse in hopes others might not see your impotent inability to offer a constructive retort. In chess they call this checkmate.

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    42. I never said schools were in good shape!!! What I said was that there are plenty of young, dedicated people doing the best they can with what they have. I also said that parents have to be involved. So my question in regard to beating their spouse is tit for tat. just as they made up a fact about me, so do I about them. Once you go down that road, there are no constructive retorts.

      The sculpin

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    43. Sculpin you said "Schools are not a joke" in your world ranking 42nd in the country or near dead last is not a joke, ranking 49th in the country in spending per student, despite having the highest personal state income and sales taxes in the country is no joke. Facts, they are pesky things are they not?

      California does lead the nation in teachers pay and teachers pensions which correlate to big union dues going to elect union leaders who give unions more pay and pension while robbing from our kids, community and culture. Despite ranking 49th in spending per student California does lead the nation in spending tax dollars on services and entitlements for illegal immigrants violating our country border laws and today illegal immigrants are rewarded with valid state drivers license while they remain exempt from the Affordable Care Act fines and income taxes while retaining the right to attend ER clinics free of charge - imagine that.

      Today WWII Vet's are turned away by armed guards of the current administration from attending public memorials while illegal immigrants and law breakers are rewarded by holding rally's on those same hallowed ground they sacrificed for.

      California may rank 42nd in student performance in learning reading, writing and science but it ranks first in the nation in explaining for 8 year olds why Johnny wants to wear a dress and use little Sally's bathroom and why little Sally must accept Johnny and get used to using the bathroom with a boy who has a penis but wears a dress- because the Government says so, it is little Sally with the problem, don't you see, it certainly is not the government who is the bully forcing it's ideas on others. Like the video claims, are schools becoming social experiments for the government? Has America been dumbed down - watch the video WC provided folks and decide for yourself.

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    44. Sigh.........when your a hammer, all you see is nails......

      -The Sculpin

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    45. Hi Sculpin- it is telling your response is a personal attack rather than offering facts to rebut the posters position. Is America being dumbed down? If yes, how so? If yes, who or what is responsible?

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    46. I believe I have already addressed this in prior posts - it has to do with assigning equal weight and legitimacy to opposing arguments when clearly that is not the case. A quick example that comes to mind is the teaching of religious dogma as science in the schools. Clearly a dumbing down of the American public. It would also be nice if a high school diploma required the ability to balance a check book. That's not dumbing down, that's starting dumb and staying there. Rhetorically speaking, would we have gotten into this pension mess if everyone knew how to balance a checkbook? Oh, and let's try and move away from using the word "facts" on this blog. Many think they have them, but no one really has any, and frankly, wouldn't know what to do with one if it jumped into their boat and bit them!

      - The Sculpin

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    47. Sculpin- In a Poolesville HS in Maryland posted an online survey for HS students asking about the religion, sexual identity and living situation of students. Were both parents in the household? were there guns in the household? They asked students 'how do you feel' about your parents political affiliation? How do you feel about obamacare? The survey then went on to ask who was to blame for the government shutdown.

      By ignoring as a one off little 8 year old johnny with a penis demanding to dress as a girl and impose on the privacy of little Sally using the bathroom we turn a blind eye to what has really happened with our public schools. They have become state run propaganda institutions indoctrinating our kids with social ideas that fit a pre-determined ideology promoted by a few in government and their unelected elites. What should be institutions of learning are fast becoming academies to indoctrinate. It is worth noting that the Hitler Youth were indoctrinated kids used by the SS to turn against their adult parents and their adult neighbors- the kids ratted out parents who had different views then the government. the Hitler Youth became kids of the state, not the family. It is also interesting to note that Hitler had a gun registry of who owned weapons in Germany and France, this allowed the SS to round up all the guns and shoot many gun owners. It is unfortunate a high school in Maryland is more interested in asking these questions than teaching math, reading and science? When questioned by parents the Poolesville HS eventually removed the survey from the internet attempting to scrub it for existence. However a school spokesperson Dan Tofig acknowledged the 'survey's' existence.

      Not the kinds of news you get from, CNN or MSNBC, maybe they were covering the illegal immigration rally with Nancy Pelosi and tax cheat Charlie Rangell................they definitely did not have much coverage of the vet's who were denied using the same public facilities.

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    48. Some good points. Reminds me of a Monty Python skit way ahead of the curve in which a baby is born and the mother asks "Is it a boy or a girl?" and the doctor says "I think it's a little early to start imposing gender roles on it don't you?"

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    49. 11:20 - you make my point oh so well......It is NOT worth noting "that the Hitler Youth were indoctrinated kids used by the SS to turn against their adult parents and their adult neighbors-". You imply an equivalency between a survey in Maryland (and here I thought we were talking about California) and Hitler that just doesn't exist in any reasonable person's mind! This is why it is so dificult to respond to so many of these posts - just too many non-sequiters and false equivalencies.......... but it does make for humorous reading.......

      - The Sculpin

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    50. Scuplin- The idea of the state indoctrinating the youth with political ideology did not exist in the minds of parents in Germany until after they learned their children had been indoctrinated and kids began turning in their parents to the state for having opposing views- that is the whole point you not only discard but mock.

      You are entitled to your opinion that it is ok for schools to ask children what political affiliation their parents are. You are entitled to your opinion that the state asking kids what political affiliation their parents are is acceptable and humorous, I find it alarming. I went and searched this story online and it appears all true.

      Also, I checked and California does rank 42 in school performance, no joke. You are entitled to think being near last in performance is acceptable, I see it as a failure.

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    51. 2:43 - Your entire point rests on the inability of German parents to realize that the Hitler youth program was indoctrinating their kids? The same Hitler who believed in a centralized form of government (fascist dictatorship) that controlled every facet of every day life. Somehow you equate that with events occuring within today's decentralized educational bureaucracy in a democratically elected government in one of the freeiest countries in the world?? Do you now understand my point about false equivalancies - in other words, are you f'ing serious?!?!?!? That simply does not deserve any kind of rebuttal or response!!

      OK - on another note, please show me where I have stated the following:
      - "it is ok for schools to ask children what political affiliation their parents are", and
      - "that the state asking kids what political affiliation their parents are is acceptable".
      I'll cop to the humorous part.
      Guess what - you won't find me expressing that opinion anywhere, because I haven't expressed it, and I also don't agree with it. You're entitled to your opinion, but you're not entitled to make my opinions for me. So let's keep it simple - my opinion is that generally schools are failing our kids. I think we agree on that point. Where we disagree, and where there may a possible source of your confusion, is that I do not agree with you on the causes. I disagree with you that Johnny's sexuality has anything to do with it. It doesn't. Johnny's friends don't care. I disagree that the schools should get back to the 3R's. While important, the world has moved so far beyond the 3R's that it now has become a component of the fundamentals, not the only fundamental.

      - The Sculpin

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  19. Sculpin,

    Just like there was no "proven" scientific link between smoking and lung cancer for years.

    You are so clueless. The more you post, the more I loose respect for you. Thank God all people in Olivenhain are not as clueless as you....

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    1. Not sure what you mean....there was always a proven link between cancer and smoking in the science community. It's only in the public realm that the link was muddled and confused.

      - The Sculpin

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    2. yeah, right, Sculpin. the tobacco industry didn't do anything to confuse the smoking-cancer connection. right.

      http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2007-02/su-tco021307.php

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    3. err........1:50 - that was my point.......

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    4. err.. 2:07pm (Sculpin?), note that the tobacco industry fought the finding "in both the public AND the scientific community"...

      was that your point, that the tobacco industry didn't try to co-opt the scientific community?

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    5. No, 3:44. My point was exactly what I stated. Yes, the tobacco industry hired an army of scientists and researchers to refute the findings of the community, but for many in the community, those scientists and researchers lost alot of credibility. Their findings were clearly skewed. Naturally, we all see more clearly in hindsight.
      And yes, I failed to sign my 2:07 post. Sorry...

      - The Sculpin

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  20. This comment has been removed by the author.

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